I watched a discussion forum in which Lawrence Krauss gave an example of "something from nothing". He said that when an electron emits a photon something is created from nothing because the electron is not diminished in any way. So, for us non-scientists, is this a good reply to use when arguing with those theists that say something can not come from nothing? Does this reply reveal a basic principle of nature that extends to a more universal application in debate?

Seems to me like a really bad example for anything. The electron radiates off a photon, and the energy the photon gets is carried by the electron before that. I don't know how that would qualify as creation from nothing. Sure, the electron is still there after the radiation event, but is that what creation from nothing is?

(October 5, 2016 at 4:55 am)Alex K Wrote: Seems to me like a really bad example for anything. The electron radiates off a photon, and the energy the photon gets is carried by the electron before that. I don't know how that would qualify as creation from nothing. Sure, the electron is still there after the radiation event, but is that what creation from nothing is?

Seemed a bit to easy. Thanks Alex. Finally I can disagree with Krauss about something.

It's like the "why are there still monkeys" argument of quantum physics

So essentially the electron has gathered this energy then releases it in the form of a photon?

(October 5, 2016 at 5:35 am)chimp3 Wrote: So essentially the electron has gathered this energy then releases it in the form of a photon?

Yup. In the language of feynman diagrams, the electron absorbs a bit of energy and "goes off the mass shell" as the jargon says, which means it briefly violates the E=mc^2 relation in order to store the energy which then gets pumpted e.g. into a newly created photon.

(October 5, 2016 at 5:50 am)Alex K Wrote:

(October 5, 2016 at 5:35 am)chimp3 Wrote: So essentially the electron has gathered this energy then releases it in the form of a photon?

Yup. In the language of feynman diagrams, the electron absorbs a bit of energy and "goes off the mass shell" as the jargon says, which means it briefly violates the E=mc^2 relation in order to store the energy which then gets pumpted e.g. into a newly created photon.

Fascinating. Thanks.

Maybe you misunderstood what Krauss was saying?

No, he offered as an example of something from nothing. Tommorow I will post the video.

(October 5, 2016 at 7:58 am)chimp3 Wrote: No, he offered as an example of something from nothing. Tommorow I will post the video.

Yes, do that and let's see if Alex still disagrees then.

But even so, I suspect this may not be so much a debate about physics as it is about language.