(November 22, 2016 at 11:53 am)Maelstrom Wrote:

(November 22, 2016 at 11:51 am)vorlon13 Wrote: BTW:

I'm not real skilled at evaluating female faces for some reason (maybe it's due to the homo thing, Idunno) but why does she look like his SISTER ?

Incest is perfectly fine, according to the bible.

Hell sometimes it's required.  Wasn't there some father who had to boff his daughter for some reason in the big book scriptures?

(November 22, 2016 at 11:51 am)Mister Agenda Wrote:

The Joker Wrote:I think Atheist forum should be place where everyone can get right deep into atheist thinking and examine them for study.

I'll pretend you're being serious for a moment. It's a place where atheists and well-behaved theist guests can have an online community and interesting discussions. Your idea of what it should be is, frankly, bizarre.

The Joker Wrote:To be honest I Just don’t think Atheism is better than the Christian standard, now before you go on about how I am an idiot and calling me names, consider the following:

Atheism is the state of mind of not holding a belief that any supernatural deity is real. Theism is the opposite state. They are both opinions on a single topic. It is ridiculous to compare an opinion to an ideology or religion. If you want to compare Christianity to something nominally atheistic, I suggest humanism.

The Joker Wrote:Christianit,y on Morality: Morality is objective(Objective morals are those that are based outside of yourself). Morality is absolute and unchanging and comes from God, all Men and Women know right from wrong because they are created in Gods image.
Atheism on Morality: Morality is subjective( Subjective moraals are those that depend on you, your situation, culture, and your preferences. Subjective morals change, can become contradictory, and might differ from person to person.) So if the public agreed that killing children from families that have more than one child is okay, then it is actually okay. Jeffrey Dahmer an atheist who was sentenced to prison for 900yrs, He brutally killed seventeen men and boys, dismembering them, storing their parts, and indulging in cannibalism and necrophilia. He said “if a person doesn’t think that there is a God to be accountable to, then what’s the point of trying to modify your behaviour to keep it within a acceptable ranges?”.  If you, as an atheist, say that what is morally good is that which reduces over-all harm, then on what basis do you validate that assertion as being a proper moral standard?

Neither atheism nor theism address any of that. This is what  happens when you compare an opinion to a belief system. There are thousands of different theistic religions, but only one theism (believing there is some kind of real deity). There are many atheistic philosophies, but only one atheism (not believing there is some kind of real deity). You're having the wrong discussion in your head. Do you want to talk about a moral philosophy compatible with atheism like humanism or an epistemological philosophy compatible with atheism like rational skepticism? Because then you would be comparing apples to apples, and dealing with what many here actually think. There is nothing in atheism that prevents moral realism, because atheism is only the position that one doesn't believe in God or gods.

The Joker Wrote:Greatest Role model’s for Christianity: Jesus, Mary and the apostles, the martyrs of faith and saints.
Greatest Role model’s for Atheism: Hitler, Stalin, Lenin, Napoleon and Jim Jones.

Still pretending you're serious. Hard to do when the obvious counter would be that the greatest role models for Christianity would be Hitler, Torquemada, Lucretia Borgia, and Jim Jones. Because citing villains as role models is asinine, but I've got as much justification for my picks as you have for yours. The role models I pick for atheism are Robert Wilson, Madame Curie, Mark Zuckerberg, Henri Matisse, Sir Richard Burton, Frank Lloyd Wright, and a slew of Nobel Prize winners.

The Joker Wrote:True Christian Family: Family hierarchy the husband the head, children properly disciplined and brought up in the Christian order, Children obey parents and daily worship and pray and visits to church. Peace at home. No divorce rates in a true Christian family.

No True Scotsman fallacy. There would hardly be any Christians left if you only count the families you've just described. I could say atheist families are harmonious, open to learning, with children who grow up to be independent and accomplished; and no divorce rates in a true atheist family; with equal justification.

The Joker Wrote:The Atheistic Family: No family hierarchy but democracy where everyone rules, husband not the head, no family order, no family discipline children rebelling against parents, husbands and wives quarrelling often, wife not obeying & husband not listening. Divorce rates extremely high, moral standards very low-morality is subjective. No peace in the family. Envies against one another.

Since atheism is just an opinion, there's nothing inherent in atheism against reasonable discipline or adults having authority over children. There's zero evidence that they quarrel more, that their divorce rates are high, or that their moral standards are low. Atheists don't have to believe morality is subjective, and moral subjectivity doesn't necessitate low moral standards.

The Joker Wrote:The Atheist agenda:  Self-Righteous, Very high egoticism, Pride is essentially self-worship. Anything we accomplish in this world would not have been possible were it not for God enabling and sustaining us. (Admitting sin and acknowledging that in our own strength we can do nothing to inherit eternal life is a constant stumbling block for prideful people.)

There is no atheist agenda. It's not just your God we don't believe in. Again, you're comparing apples and oranges. Atheism is an opinion, Christianity is a religion, see the difference? Either compare atheism and theism, or a specific belief system common among atheism to a specific religion. You won't find a belief system we all agree on, just like theists don't have one they all agree with. And you're essentially accusing atheists of not believing in God here. No duh. Self-righteousness, high egotism, pride, and self-worship don't follow from that; though you seem to have some of them covered yourself.

The Joker Wrote:Christianity: To Accomplish God’s will daily, always ready to repent when sinned, striving for humility and meekness. To the carry the cross.

There seems to be a conflict between striving for humility and meekness while claiming to be under direct orders from the creator of the universe and belittling and insulting anyone who doesn't buy into your assertions.

The Joker Wrote:Why Atheists have still not found God: They aren’t looking and second they want to avoid him. Just assuming the God of the Bible is evil without reading within context or based on what other people think.
Main fundamental doctrine of Atheism: The denial of God through lack of belief, Core foundation is self will and trusting in the theory of evolution.

Not all atheists believe the theory of evolution, and if it was struck down tomorrow, that still wouldn't provide a reason to believe God is real unless what struck it down was that new species actually poof into existence out of nothingness...that would be pretty convincing to me. The rest seems to be an equally apt description of why Christians still have not found Brahma (at least the Hindus call their version of God by his proper name, seriously, it's like naming your dog, Dog).

And at this point I'm tired of writing responses to your rant. I doubt I'm the only one who has taken the time to address some of your points. It's not the Poe-ing I mind so much as the inconsiderate posting of a conglomeration of rambling thoughts to wade through.

Lol I'm impressed that you took the time to respond to all this.

The Bible did have some restrictions:

one man could not marry 2 or more women who are sisters of each other

one man could not marry a mother and her daughter


Curiously, despite advertising Mormon polygamy as following the Bible proscriptions precisely, the Mormons did not observe those 2 restrictions for some reason I can't recall off hand . . .



oh, wait, it was because the LDS men were poonhounds. Yeah, that's it.

The Joker Wrote:

Alasdair Ham Wrote:Either you don't understand evolution, or you're a Poe, or you're a Poe who doesn't understand evolution.

I don't believe these claims - convince me that your evolution did it.

I don't think many of us actually care if you accept established science or not. If I had my way, you'd have to pass a test that shows you understand the basics of evolution before you were allowed to argue about it, but I'm not the king of the internet. I don't want you to change your mind, because I'm worried you'll represent atheists as badly as you do Christians.

Try cracking a science book or two if you want to understand the evidence for evolution. There are a ton of books on evolutionary biology. If you insist on strangers on the internet spoon feeding you an education on the topic, there are plenty of old treads that do that, you could trouble yourself to read one of them and save us the trouble of repeating ourselves.

Or at least start a thread on that specific topic. This thing where you try to make 30 points in one post does not make for a very focused conversation.

Mr. A, this Joker guy has as good a chance of being a Poe as a troll. Whatever his religious status may be, he seems to be here to annoy more than to sell time shares in paradise.

The Joker Wrote:

chimp3 Wrote:Bump!

This law is applies to Israel, have you ever seen a christian fathers going around stoning children, in the new testament this law is not necessary.

In the Old Testament, God appears harsh for three reasons. First, it was to demonstrate the exacting requirements of the Law--a perfect and demanding standard. Second, it ultimately demonstrates the need for grace that would eventually be manifested on the cross. Third, should rebellion take root the very heart of the gospel would be at risk since the prophecies of the Messiah coming to and through Israel could be undermined should rebellion become rampant and society fall apart causing the prophecies to fail. Therefore, we can conclude that this harsh requirement was a necessary legality to instill and designate the necessity of family order and respect and to ultimately provide another safeguard that would ensure the sacrifice of Christ.

So God asked the Jews to follow one version of morality and Christians to follow a different one? Read the Bible cover-to-cover twice, I noticed that too.

The Joker Wrote:

Catholic_Lady Wrote:Soooo, is this Poe going to stay then? Lol.

It depends on what you mean by stay.

Not go.

Or possibly, not go and also not admit you're a Poe.

The Joker Wrote:

Catholic_Lady Wrote:Soooo, is this Poe going to stay then? Lol.

What is a Poe?

A Poe is someone who pretends on the internet to hold positions they don't actually hold, in order to make the people who do hold those positions look bad. The classic example is an atheist who pretends to be a Christian and makes particularly bad arguments and treats people with disrespect.

Famously, it's very hard to tell a Poe from the real thing, whether they are good or bad at it, because there are sincere examples of the group being mocked acting the same way.

So, when a person who's presentation for their side is particularly appalling and stereotypical comes along, making uncharitable assertions about us, they are often suspected of being a Poe. It's impossible to be sure unless they admit it, though.

Speaking of charity, being accused of being a Poe is actually a compliment compared to be taken for face value. It implies you're someone who is bored and playing a prank, not someone who actually thinks what they're doing is worthwhile communication, which would be even sadder.

The Joker Wrote:So to sum it all up, God knows the right thing to do, at the right time, at the right place.

If God exists and is omniscient. The Bible is the claim about God, not the evidence. Maybe you should establish that God is real before you try to establish God's character profile and super powers.

The Joker Wrote:Waw, an unusual kind of atheist.

An unusual kind of human. Most humans don't make a lot of effort to be respectful to those who are disrespectful of them, and Christians don't seem to be an exception any more frequently than Wiccans or atheists.