The odds of intelligent life occurring are EXACTLY 1:1.

Boru

(September 19, 2017 at 5:09 am)ignoramus Wrote: This is why I believe intelligent life is so ridiculously rare, it's practically a novelty of the universe.
So rare that 99.999% of all other intelligent life (I'm not saying there is any, please don't put words in my mouth!), won't ever contact any other life.

So yes theists, we are special! (but not in the way you guys think we are)

We underwent miraculous odds to get here so what do we do? Elect Trump in the position of the most powerful man in the known universe!@

   

Don't really have a point to make ... Just putting it out there.

I think that intelligent life is widespread throughout the Cosmos, at least trillions of advanced civilizations in fact.  What makes them so hard to detect is the vastness of space and time and the fact that there is probably no physics beyond the standard model and General Relativity, which means that faster than light travel and/or communication is an absolute impossibility.

I'd say wherever evolution can occur, if the resources and environment are complex enough, intelligence must eventually also occur. Intelligence just means high-order processing, and this is clearly linear rather than punctuated-- i.e. there's no critical mass at which pop! intelligence pops into the system.

I suspect that to a highly intelligent species, we may not be all that, after all. We are pretty biased.

(September 19, 2017 at 5:21 pm)bennyboy Wrote: I'd say wherever evolution can occur, if the resources and environment are complex enough, intelligence must eventually also occur.  Intelligence just means high-order processing, and this is clearly linear rather than punctuated-- i.e. there's no critical mass at which pop! intelligence pops into the system.

I suspect that to a highly intelligent species, we may not be all that, after all.  We are pretty biased.

I'd agree with you but would just like to add that the increasing complexity of the environment and the development of intelligence would drive one another.

(September 19, 2017 at 5:21 pm)bennyboy Wrote: I'd say wherever evolution can occur, if the resources and environment are complex enough, intelligence must eventually also occur.  Intelligence just means high-order processing, and this is clearly linear rather than punctuated-- i.e. there's no critical mass at which pop! intelligence pops into the system.

I suspect that to a highly intelligent species, we may not be all that, after all.  We are pretty biased.

Why "must"? What requirement in nature is there for a human-equivalent?

How many species have there been through time? Including the extinct., insects, etc.
100 million? More?
And only one evolved intelligence. I wouldn't exactly call that a sample of 1 of 1.
Divide those m class planets out there by 100 million to get the true odds.

There's about (counts on fingers) ok, a lot!

(September 19, 2017 at 5:47 am)Aroura Wrote: I could be wrong, but there have been multiple intelligences already, from my understanding. Neanderthals, for instance, arose separately from homosapiens. The "hobbits" found in New Zealand also appear to have evolved separately, and they used tools, including fire. I believe there are a total of 4 or 5 separate instances of primates evolving to tool use, we are simply to only currently surviving example.

Also, define intelligent. Whales, dolphins and other cetaceans do not use tools in any advanced way, but they lack the physical abilities to really do so. They do however appear to have an emotional intelligence equal to or greater than that of humans, as well as fairly advanced actual language that they teach and pass on to their young.

I get your point, we are very unlikely, and should feel awe at our existence, but sometimes I wonder if we are really as unlikely as we think we are.

Hobbits evolved in Indonesia.

Sheep shaggers evolved in NZ.

And they were just branches of the same family, so they don't count as "extras".

(September 19, 2017 at 5:32 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote:

(September 19, 2017 at 5:21 pm)bennyboy Wrote: I'd say wherever evolution can occur, if the resources and environment are complex enough, intelligence must eventually also occur.  Intelligence just means high-order processing, and this is clearly linear rather than punctuated-- i.e. there's no critical mass at which pop! intelligence pops into the system.

I suspect that to a highly intelligent species, we may not be all that, after all.  We are pretty biased.

Why "must"? What requirement in nature is there for a human-equivalent?

Humans are not the only forms of intelligence. We are surrounded by hundreds of thousands of intelligent species.

I don't even consider humans to be the highest form of life on this planet any more. I consider corporations to be instead.

(September 19, 2017 at 5:47 pm)Mathilda Wrote:

(September 19, 2017 at 5:32 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: Why "must"? What requirement in nature is there for a human-equivalent?

Humans are not the only forms of intelligence. We are surrounded by hundreds of thousands of intelligent species.

I don't even consider humans to be the highest form of life on this planet any more. I consider corporations to be instead.

Hundreds of thousands... 

Oh, brother, I can guess where you're going with this.