You need to see a shrink, dripshit.  Plus a nice long stay in a room with padded walls.

(October 5, 2017 at 10:15 pm)Godscreated Wrote:  It's not irrational, it is quite sensible hell is a place to be feared.

GC

Lol....About as rational as grown folks fearing monsters under their bed. Or in the closet.
The notion of Hell is just as, if not more fuggin' ludicrous.

Any grown-ass adult who's a-scaredy of "Hell" needs to be (metaphorically) slapped, and hereby stop concerning themselves with magical MADE-UP bullshit immediately.

It really is that simple, OP. Don't overthink it. 
"Hell" deserves no more credence than any other imagined, impossible crap/shit-story.

(October 6, 2017 at 10:48 am)Minimalist Wrote: You need to see a shrink, dripshit.  Plus a nice long stay in a room with padded walls.

So tell me some more about what your America would look like without a constitution or bill of rights...

(September 30, 2017 at 2:03 am)Arsoo Wrote:

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Being a young adult, the idea of hell doesn't really make a whole lot of sense- yet I still fear it! I think it makes sense that the concept would have been created to scare people into being law abiding citizens in a era where law didn't exist. There was no police to stop them, so fear was the only surefire method. Today, people still buy into the fear. Although this explanation makes the most sense, I still fear the concept, that if I don't believe and I end up being incorrect, that I may suffer an afterlife of torture. Some of my fear stems from a few videos and books I have read about people who make the claim that they visited hell-- I KNOW! Being a young adult I should know better than to buy into some propaganda online or in a book, but for me, it's easier said than done. I want to let go of this, but I feel the best way to do this is to write down why I fear it, and deduce some logical conclusions with the help of others on a site where religion isn't the primary focus. On the contrary, logic is the primary focus.

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I saw a few videos where people either had a Near Death Experience, or had a dream that they visited hell. What I found to be somewhat frightening was the fact that many people described the same concepts in their versions of hell.

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Commonly, they were:
- fire and brimstone
- demons which look like reptiles that attack them
- the people who say they went to hell often report being put into a cage or a cube
- they hear other people suffering and whaling
- often they get burnt or beaten, and when they lose a piece of skin or a body part, it grows back and they get tortured again.
Now, I know this all sounds like some fairy tale, but I saw at least 10 accounts like this. I don't know what to make of it. I know the concept of fire can be found as early as Augistine in the 300s or 400s, and I know the bible implies torment to those who do badly in their lives. Much of the imagery isn't too much of a shock there, but the idea that people report a multitude of cases seeing demons which they report look similar among accounts, and often torture or laugh at people suffering is what I cannot understand. Being raised Christian, I always had an image of what hell may look like. I could totally imagine how my brain during a Near death experience or a dream could create most of the fire and suffering imagery, but I would never expect hell to be filled with demons who look like reptiles. I asked some of my Christian friends, and they say the same thing. Why then, is this demon thing so consistent across "hellish" experiences? If I could get a logical answer to that, then I would be willing to say that these experiences are nothing more than a brain that is scared and confused trying to fill in the gaps during an episode. Does anyone have a plausible explanation here? It would be greatly appreciated.
Many thanks and have a great day,
Arsoo

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The people who report this are having unconscious hallucinations; they have no authority* to state eschatology (doctrine of last and final matters)  information. What happens after death is either: Persons go immediately into the presents of the Lord, or to Hades (which is a temporary abode until the Great White Judgement). What determines one's eternity is acceptance or rejections of the offer of Salvation. God's nature doesn't allow for torment,  the anguish in Hell (after Judgement) is self-imposed. Everyone see evidence of God's works of creation so that's not the issue, the issue is sin; the new creation will be a sin-free, but the really good part is that those who choose salvation will have free will without the possibility of sinning.

* Compare this authority to Aunt Jane's surgical experience to:  Rev 1:18 'I am he that lives, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive forevermore; Amen, and have the keys of Hades and of death',

(October 6, 2017 at 2:03 pm)snowtracks Wrote: What determines one's eternity is acceptance or rejections of the offer of Salvation. God's nature doesn't allow for torment,  the anguish in Hell (after Judgement) is self-imposed. Everyone see evidence of God's works of creation so that's not the issue, the issue is sin; the new creation will be a sin-free, but the really good part is that those who choose salvation will have free will without the possibility of sinning.

Why didn't god make this, creation sin free? The omniscient god knew Adam and Eve would eat the magic apple before he even created them, and the omnipresent god stood there and watched them do it, why? And why did god put the serpent in the garden, he knew exactly what the little shit was going to tell them. God set them up, they were framed. Even the O J Simpson jury would find him guilty.

My bold.

(October 6, 2017 at 10:47 am)Drich Wrote: If you want to experience it for yourself then threaten to spit in God's eye and demand he show you what was so bad about hell. Over and over and over again. I promise you. you will see Hell. What i can't promise is a return trip home. Even so that what I did. I wanted to know the truth and I jumped off a cliff to find it. I did.

Your method sounds very much like an act of self-hypnosis, especially the "over and over and over again" part.

(October 5, 2017 at 10:15 pm)Godscreated Wrote:  It's not irrational, it is quite sensible hell is a place to be feared.

Hell isn't scary. I'm scarier than Hell.

Boru Hammy

(October 6, 2017 at 1:56 pm)Drich Wrote:

(October 6, 2017 at 10:48 am)Minimalist Wrote: You need to see a shrink, dripshit.  Plus a nice long stay in a room with padded walls.

So tell me some more about what your America would look like without a  constitution or bill of rights...

Fun fact: the word 'god' doesn't appear in the Constitution.
Fun fact: most of the Founding Fathers were deists, believing in a god that was akin to a clock maker rather than one who played voyeur.
Fun fact: I actually did my senior university project on the sermons of a local Revolutionary War pastor, and how much his rhetoric played (if it played any role at all) in forming and supporting the attitudes of rebellion among the common folk.

One of the benefits of living in one of the original colonies is having the history of the era at my fingertips.  Actually being able to touch and hold the manuscripts was pretty amazing from a historical POV.  If any of you have the good fortune to visit NH, and enjoy history, check out Strawbery Banke (http://www.strawberybanke.org/).

Anyway, while it's true that the Founders generally believed in a god, it certainly wasn't the same one most Christians, especially non-denominationals and/or evangelicals, today believe in.  These were men of the Enlightenment.  And even then, their actions often belied their words (see: slavery).  

Ultimately, the genesis of our government has far more to do with British Common Law than anything to do with religion.  And if you don't believe me, you can ask my former professor (https://cola.unh.edu/faculty-member/james-farrell), who's Catholic (as though that matters).

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(October 6, 2017 at 3:27 pm)Astreja Wrote:

(October 6, 2017 at 10:47 am)Drich Wrote: If you want to experience it for yourself then threaten to spit in God's eye and demand he show you what was so bad about hell. Over and over and over again. I promise you. you will see Hell. What i can't promise is a return trip home. Even so that what I did. I wanted to know the truth and I jumped off a cliff to find it. I did.

Your method sounds very much like an act of self-hypnosis, especially the "over and over and over again" part.

Actually, it sounds more like attributing coincidence to something divine, which, I guess, could simply be the definition of superstition. "I kept doing this thing over and over, and then one time something bad actually happened, so the cause must've been that thing I thought of rather than a chance encounter/event!"

It's a symptom of a weak mind.

(October 6, 2017 at 10:47 am)Drich Wrote:

(October 5, 2017 at 10:43 pm)chimp3 Wrote: After all this time! You are still a damned liar!

Do you know how I got to go?

i demanded to see it...

If you want to experience it for yourself then threaten to spit in God's eye and demand he show you what was so bad about hell. Over and over and over again. I promise you. you will see Hell. What i can't promise is a return trip home. Even so that what I did. I wanted to know the truth and I jumped off a cliff to find it. I did.

You had a stupid dream, you fucking moron. But by all means keep misrepresenting it, like the shit you are. Every time you retell one of your stories, it gets more and more fanciful. You're a piss poor liar.

(October 6, 2017 at 1:56 pm)Drich Wrote:

(October 6, 2017 at 10:48 am)Minimalist Wrote: You need to see a shrink, dripshit.  Plus a nice long stay in a room with padded walls.

So tell me some more about what your America would look like without a  constitution or bill of rights...

The Constitution and Bill of Rights were created specifically to avoid theocracies, you moron.

Here's one for you:

The Treaty of Tripoli (created under Washington, and ratified under Adams)

"As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen (Muslims); and as the said States never entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mahometan (Mohammedan) nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries"