(January 3, 2019 at 2:08 pm)Fake Messiah Wrote:

Angelina Wrote:Christians and Jews have become great allies in the war against poverty, disease, and hunger in the world.

Not realy:
Jewish leader Rabbi Yosef Shalom Eliashiv issued a ruling banning Haredi Jews from taking funds from the Fellowship, citing worries of Christian missionary activity and idol worship.

Rabbi Avraham Shapira, a rabbi of Zionism and Orthodox Judaism, issued a ruling against accepting funds from the Fellowship. In 2002 the Edah HaChareidis Ultra-Orthodox Jewish rabbinical court issued a ruling against accepting funds from the Fellowship, and, in 2007, the new Chief Rabbi of the said Edah HaChareidis, Yitzchok Tuvia Weiss added his signature.

In 2014, many Religious Zionist rabbis reiterated their position that it is forbidden to take money from the IFCJ. Religious Zionist rabbis claim the enrollment of many Israeli children in summer camps problematic, as the Israeli Ministry of Education utilizes IFCJ money to partially funds their camps.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internat...s_and_Jews

Angelina Wrote:I am not a Catholic.

So Catholics are not real Christians? Their deeds don't count as Christian deeds?

Right wing Christians, such as Angelina, fail to mention that their political, economic and social policies create poverty; makes it easier to prey upon poor people.

Angelina, I favor strongly, universal healthcare, a single-payer system and the abolition of the death penalty. Where do you stand on these issues?

(January 3, 2019 at 2:23 pm)Jehanne Wrote:

(January 3, 2019 at 2:08 pm)Fake Messiah Wrote: Not realy:
Jewish leader Rabbi Yosef Shalom Eliashiv issued a ruling banning Haredi Jews from taking funds from the Fellowship, citing worries of Christian missionary activity and idol worship.

Rabbi Avraham Shapira, a rabbi of Zionism and Orthodox Judaism, issued a ruling against accepting funds from the Fellowship. In 2002 the Edah HaChareidis Ultra-Orthodox Jewish rabbinical court issued a ruling against accepting funds from the Fellowship, and, in 2007, the new Chief Rabbi of the said Edah HaChareidis, Yitzchok Tuvia Weiss added his signature.

In 2014, many Religious Zionist rabbis reiterated their position that it is forbidden to take money from the IFCJ. Religious Zionist rabbis claim the enrollment of many Israeli children in summer camps problematic, as the Israeli Ministry of Education utilizes IFCJ money to partially funds their camps.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internat...s_and_Jews


So Catholics are not real Christians? Their deeds don't count as Christian deeds?

Right wing Christians, such as Angelina, fail to mention that their political, economic and social policies create poverty; makes it easier to prey upon poor people.

Angelina, I favor strongly, universal healthcare, a single-payer system and the abolition of the death penalty.  Where do you stand on these issues?

What policies are you talking about?  The only policy is based on the idea of community and sharing resources.  No need to prey on anybody.

Universal healthcare - depends how it is setup and how it is funded.  Would be more interested in seeing better regulations in the medical industry to keep costs down.  My biggest issue with it though is that if we give the government more power, then there's always a risk of abuse of that gained power.  Even if not know, then in the future.

Death Penalty - It depends on the crime. If someone goes on a killing spree, I would rather see switch justice and I have no issue with the death penalty. The victims don't get to go on living, so why should they?  But only if we can be certain, and no need for long trials.  Like the school or nightclub shootings we've had in recent years.  We know the person brutally murdered others, so let the choice they made for others be their choice.

I am going to start a new thread; no sense derailing this one any further.

(January 3, 2019 at 2:23 pm)Jehanne Wrote: Right wing Christians, such as Angelina, fail to mention that their political, economic and social policies create poverty; makes it easier to prey upon poor people.

Angelina, I favor strongly, universal healthcare, a single-payer system and the abolition of the death penalty.  Where do you stand on these issues?

I am a moderate democrat who fought hard to try to get Hillary elected, and even helped organize marches for women after Trump won. You should stop stereo-typing people.I am for a health care system similiar to Japan's. This is from a friend of mine.

"We never have the right debate in America concerning healthcare which would get to the root of the problem. Should we allow healthcare to be just another business run for profit? Japan asked this question and said no and set up not for profit corporations to administer healthcare. So now an ultrasound exam that costs many thousands of dollars in the US cost less than $100. Doctors are paid well but there are few millionaire MDs in Japan. Hospitals are not for profit and so a room there is a fraction of the cost in the US. There are NO insurance companies taking a huge chunk of healthcare dollars as profits for themselves and their stockholders and there is no multimillion dollar lobbyist being paid by healthcare dollars to influence Japans government to help them bilk the sick and injured. Because it is not for profit drug companies are forced to compete for the business and the government negotiates far cheaper prices than these same companies charge in our for profit system. Way more money is spent on prevention in Japan because in a not for profit system good health outcomes are rewarded instead of the sickly being profitable in our messed up parasitic system. As long as for profit corporations run our system healthcare will remain the largest government expenditure and the underlying problem of soaring cost will never be addressed because high costs, sick people and large profits is what our system is designed to produce"

The death penalty? I am ok with it being either way, because I think both sides make valid arguments, and I do not think of death as final.

(January 4, 2019 at 3:34 am)Angelina Wrote: "We never have the right debate in America concerning healthcare which would get to the root of the problem. Should we allow healthcare to be just another business run for profit? Japan asked this question and said no and set up not for profit corporations to administer healthcare. So now an ultrasound exam that costs many thousands of dollars in the US cost less than $100. Doctors are paid well but there are few millionaire MDs in Japan. Hospitals are not for profit and so a room there is a fraction of the cost in the US. There are NO insurance companies taking a huge chunk of healthcare dollars as profits for themselves and their stockholders and there is no multimillion dollar lobbyist being paid by healthcare dollars to influence Japans government to help them bilk the sick and injured. Because it is not for profit drug companies are forced to compete for the business and the government negotiates far cheaper prices than these same companies charge in our for profit system. Way more money is spent on prevention in Japan because in a not for profit system good health outcomes are rewarded instead of the sickly being profitable in our messed up parasitic system. As long as for profit corporations run our system healthcare will remain the largest government expenditure and the underlying problem of soaring cost will never be addressed because high costs, sick people and large profits is what our system is designed to produce"

That's because Japan has almost no Christian population to speak of.

(January 3, 2019 at 3:26 pm)T0 Th3 M4X Wrote: My biggest issue with it though is that if we give the government more power, then there's always a risk of abuse of that gained power.  Even if not know, then in the future.

Oh yeah? You better like society with gigantic corporations that can subsidize the government and make them poison the people so they can make a profit?
I do get why Christians are pushing this "big government" mantra because then lobbyists can't control the politicians. This way rich companies, including Churches, can buy politicians and make them do what ever they want. And this is why Christians love Trump no matter how "unchristian" he behaves because they can easily buy him and as oil and coal companies are having they way with him so do Christian organizations, I mean take Betsy DeVos who is loosening federal regulations on religious colleges and universities so that faith-based entities can receive federally administered funding.

Quote:My biggest issue with it though is that if we give the government more power, then there's always a risk of abuse of that gained power.  Even if not know, then in the future.

As opposed to corporations having more power ?

(January 4, 2019 at 4:42 am)Fake Messiah Wrote:

(January 4, 2019 at 3:34 am)Angelina Wrote: "We never have the right debate in America concerning healthcare which would get to the root of the problem. Should we allow healthcare to be just another business run for profit? Japan asked this question and said no and set up not for profit corporations to administer healthcare. So now an ultrasound exam that costs many thousands of dollars in the US cost less than $100. Doctors are paid well but there are few millionaire MDs in Japan. Hospitals are not for profit and so a room there is a fraction of the cost in the US. There are NO insurance companies taking a huge chunk of healthcare dollars as profits for themselves and their stockholders and there is no multimillion dollar lobbyist being paid by healthcare dollars to influence Japans government to help them bilk the sick and injured. Because it is not for profit drug companies are forced to compete for the business and the government negotiates far cheaper prices than these same companies charge in our for profit system. Way more money is spent on prevention in Japan because in a not for profit system good health outcomes are rewarded instead of the sickly being profitable in our messed up parasitic system. As long as for profit corporations run our system healthcare will remain the largest government expenditure and the underlying problem of soaring cost will never be addressed because high costs, sick people and large profits is what our system is designed to produce"

That's because Japan has almost no Christian population to speak of.

(January 3, 2019 at 3:26 pm)T0 Th3 M4X Wrote: My biggest issue with it though is that if we give the government more power, then there's always a risk of abuse of that gained power.  Even if not know, then in the future.

Oh yeah? You better like society with gigantic corporations that can subsidize the government and make them poison the people so they can make a profit?
I do get why Christians are pushing this "big government" mantra because then lobbyists can't control the politicians. This way rich companies, including Churches, can buy politicians and make them do what ever they want. And this is why Christians love Trump no matter how "unchristian" he behaves because they can easily buy him and as oil and coal companies are having they way with him so do Christian organizations, I mean take Betsy DeVos who is loosening federal regulations on religious colleges and universities so that faith-based entities can receive federally administered funding.

I don't know where you are from, but here in the United States, usually Christians are less about "big government."  I'm not one to get into all the left and right nonsense, but usually big government is associated with the left, and you'll hear about Christians being more aligned with the right.  It doesn't bother me if corporations make a lot of money.  In fact, I would rather they do.  What I do like to see is regulations that keep the economy fair and stable.  If someone makes a billion or two in the process, good for them.  If it were me running their business, I would be more than happy to reap such rewards.  Also keeping businesses happy helps keep them here, which in turn provides jobs.

I don't like Trump's attitude.  I think he jumps the gun a lot and he goes overboard with how he responds to people.  But I will say to you what I say to everybody else.  I support Trump, but I would've equally supported Hillary if she was elected.  Supporting doesn't mean you agree with someone on everything.  It means you give them your best as to contribute to an optimal outcome.  If everybody stopped nitpicking about nonsense, we would accomplish a lot more as a nation.

As far as funding for Christians.  Well you know something, there are Christians who are U.S. citizens, there are atheists who are U.S. citizens, and there are thousands of other demographics we can categorize people under, but at the end of the day we are Americans.  That is who those politicians are responsible for.  They are there to represent us ALL.

Define big government ? 

Drug wars 
Border walls 
Space forces 

These are big government

(January 4, 2019 at 4:55 am)Amarok Wrote:

Quote:My biggest issue with it though is that if we give the government more power, then there's always a risk of abuse of that gained power.  Even if not know, then in the future.

As opposed to corporations having more power ?

Power to do what?  Power to develop and expand?  Sure!  Power to run smaller businesses out of town?  Nope.  Not at all.  There needs to be a healthy balance.

Our government is already too powerful and many of our politicians live by a higher standard than the citizens.  Instead of being servants of the people, which is their civil duty, they are trying to assert power over us and tell us how we must live.  IMO, we're long overdue for the next Boston Tea Party so that we can show the government that they are asserting themselves too much and taking from us the very things they should be guarding.

(January 4, 2019 at 5:04 am)T0 Th3 M4X Wrote:

(January 4, 2019 at 4:55 am)Amarok Wrote: As opposed to corporations having more power ?

Power to do what?  Power to develop and expand?  Sure!  Power to run smaller businesses out of town?  Nope.  Not at all.  There needs to be a healthy balance.

Our government is already too powerful and many of our politicians live by a higher standard than the citizens.  Instead of being servants of the people, which is their civil duty, they are trying to assert power over us and tell us how we must live.  IMO, we're long overdue for the next Boston Tea Party so that we can show the government that they are asserting themselves too much and taking from us the very things they should be guarding.

Power to manipulate and profit at the cost off other peoples freedom . You seriously think all they do is develop and expand . I'm sorry that's naïve .Corporations can be just as evil as any government .And they very much want to control you .