Daniel, talking to people is still just hearsay, though you love presenting hearsay as evidence. The proof is in the pudding, so to speak. From everything that we do know and can physically see with our own eyes through photographs and film, there is nothing atheist about North Korea. What this boils down to is your, and obviously North Korea's, misunderstanding of what atheism means. It does not mean we just don't believe in your biblical god. It means we also do not believe that Kim Jong-Il was a demi-god. North Koreans believe the latter. Therefore, they are not atheists. Now, I have seen, with my own eyes, people bowing down and worshiping Kim Jong-Il. I have heard them tell stories of his godly birth, godly life and godly death. This stuff is available for anyone with youtube and a willingness to stop being willfully obtuse in order to maintain a position that is not realistic. Ditch the latter. I'm sure you have the former. Then, voila -- you have found your own proof without trying to force me to seek it out for you.

And, again, love the return of your shirt.

(December 29, 2012 at 3:47 pm)Shell B Wrote: Daniel, talking to people is still just hearsay, though you love presenting hearsay as evidence. The proof is in the pudding, so to speak. From everything that we do know and can physically see with our own eyes through photographs and film, there is nothing atheist about North Korea. What this boils down to is your, and obviously North Korea's, misunderstanding of what atheism means. It does not mean we just don't believe in your biblical god. It means we also do not believe that Kim Jong-Il was a demi-god. North Koreans believe the latter. Therefore, they are not atheists. Now, I have seen, with my own eyes, people bowing down and worshiping Kim Jong-Il. I have heard them tell stories of his godly birth, godly life and godly death. This stuff is available for anyone with youtube and a willingness to stop being willfully obtuse in order to maintain a position that is not realistic. Ditch the latter. I'm sure you have the former. Then, voila -- you have found your own proof without trying to force me to seek it out for you.

And, again, love the return of your shirt.

I really hate when people try to equate atheists to Kim Jong Ill, or Hitler or Stalin. The intent of all three of those monsters is the same as the god/s of abraham. Absolute final power, with no ability to those under it to put a check on his power, or impeach him, or vote him out of office. "God" by definition can only be a dictator.

There are pictures online of Hitler schmoosing with the clergy. Hitler's secret service belt buckles read "Gott Mit Uns"(God Is With Us)

And Stalin was prior to becoming a dictator, was an ordained minister. And even in Communist Russia religion did not go away, after the fall of the Soviet Union the churches were allowed to be open, rather than silent, but they never went away. The only thing Stalin did was silence dissent. So as long as you were silent, and didn't compete with him, he let you live.

God as the character written in the bible from beginning to end, only treats his minions well, all others who try to buck his rule are meet with retribution. The middle part where Jesus comes in is the only attempt to somewhat water down this bloodthirsty character.

But even in the NT Jesus says to abandon anyone, including your own family if they do not follow him.

The plot of the bible reads like an abusive spouse.

Part 1. "Be a good Hebrew and no one gets hurt"
Part 2. "I'll fake a suicide and pretend that I wont beat you anymore"
Part 3. "Screw it, I'll take my minions an throw all the rest out like trash".

Just like an abusive spouse.

"If you would just do what I say I wouldn't have beat the crap out of you"
"I am sorry I beat the crap out of you, promise I wont do it again"
"Yes, I lied about not beating the crap out of you again because I don't have to answer to you".

(December 29, 2012 at 6:41 pm)Brian37 Wrote: I really hate when people try to equate atheists to Kim Jong Ill, or Hitler or Stalin. The intent of all three of those monsters is the same as the god/s of abraham. Absolute final power, with no ability to...

I really hate it when athiests complain about the immorality/ungodliness of other atheists.

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BTW - God doesnt have the intent to be God. He already IS.

(December 30, 2012 at 6:04 pm)Lion IRC Wrote:

(December 29, 2012 at 6:41 pm)Brian37 Wrote: I really hate when people try to equate atheists to Kim Jong Ill, or Hitler or Stalin. The intent of all three of those monsters is the same as the god/s of abraham. Absolute final power, with no ability to...

I really hate it when athiests complain about the immorality/ungodliness of other atheists.

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BTW - God doesnt have the intent to be God. He already IS.

What?

No, I am complaining about THEISTS, who equate atheists to monsters like Hitler and Stalin.

Just because you don't like the way other believers think, does not mean they dont have a god belief. It only means you don't agree with them.

(December 27, 2012 at 10:48 pm)Tiberius Wrote: My beef with the 5th commandment is that there are some parents who should not be honoured. I'm talking about parents who abuse their children or disown them. Why do they deserve honour? Parents have to earn their children's honour as anyone else does...

Why would any parent abuse or abandon their own child?

Why even start a family if you arent committed to honoring family val...........

(December 30, 2012 at 6:20 pm)Lion IRC Wrote: Why would any parent abuse or abandon their own child?

Some people are assholes.

''A brother will betray his brother to death, a father will betray his own child, and children will rebel against their parents and cause them to be killed.
And everyone will hate you because you are my followers. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.''

Welcome and thanks to our new member. Mark 13:13

(December 30, 2012 at 6:40 pm)Lion IRC Wrote: A brother will betray his brother to death, a father will betray his own child, and children will rebel against their parents and cause them to be killed.
And everyone will hate you because you are my followers. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.

Welcome and thanks to our new member. Mark 13:13

Does this somehow imply you should respect a parent even if they are abusive even if they end up killing you? Sounds pretty stupid.

(December 30, 2012 at 6:18 pm)Brian37 Wrote: I really hate when people try to equate atheists to Kim Jong Ill, or Hitler or Stalin. The intent of all three of those monsters is the same as the god/s of abraham. Absolute final power, with no ability to...

(December 30, 2012 at 6:04 pm)Lion IRC Wrote: I really hate it when athiests complain about the immorality/ungodliness of other atheists.

BTW - God doesnt have the intent to be God. He already IS.

What?

No, I am complaining about THEISTS, who equate atheists to monsters like Hitler and Stalin...

Yes, I understood that.

And my complaint is that, if I were an atheist/godless person doing whatever law-of-the-jungle stuff I was able to get away with, I would hate being called a monster by some mere primate or any other species.

I would tell them to step off.

And I would ask them by what sanctimonious right do they dare presume to moralise @me

And I would tell them that blind evolution had favored me with bigger fists and sharper teeth and more testosterone and to mind their own business or else they are gonna be next!

(December 30, 2012 at 10:07 pm)Lion IRC Wrote: And my complaint is that, if I were an atheist/godless person doing whatever law-of-the-jungle stuff I was able to get away with, I would hate being called a monster by some mere primate or any other species.

I would tell them to step off.

And I would ask them by what sanctimonious right do they dare presume to moralise @me

And I would tell them that blind evolution had favored me with bigger fists and sharper teeth and more testosterone and to mind their own business or else they are gonna be next!

Then you are a terrible person. I empathize with my fellow human. We are a social species with empathetic views. Only the religious want to make us hate ourselves and I won't allow it. We are not perfect of course but when I see somebody harmed I feel their pain. I don't need anyone to tell me I need to help, I want to help. That is not religion, it is human.