The following is a quote from the BHA website that Darwinian cited in the thread "Agressive Secularism?"

Quote:"Non-believers" do, of course, have many beliefs, though not religious ones. For example, they typically hold that moral feelings are social in origin, based on treating others as they would wish to be treated (the 'golden rule' which antedates all the major world religions).

As an atheist, do you agree with this quote? Do you strive to follow the golden rule?

Yes, but then the "golden rule" seems to stem from an evolutionary basis; that we evolved morality and the golden rule with it, to survive as a species. Individually we aren't very powerful, and faced with a larger more aggressive animal we'd probably lose out. Together, we are more powerful than anything else. We need to work together to survive.

(October 19, 2009 at 8:33 am)rjh4 Wrote: The following is a quote from the BHA website that Darwinian cited in the thread "Agressive Secularism?"

Quote:"Non-believers" do, of course, have many beliefs, though not religious ones. For example, they typically hold that moral feelings are social in origin, based on treating others as they would wish to be treated (the 'golden rule' which antedates all the major world religions).

As an atheist, do you agree with this quote? Do you strive to follow the golden rule?

Mostly, but i don't think it is that black and white; some people wish to be treated with a respect they have not earned. Respect does not come by default, everyone is neutral to begin with and their actions dictate the extend to which i treat them.

I follow it because I care, not because some God (Or him as his son incarnated in human form) - that I know of no evidence for whatsoever - says I should... in some book he is supposed to be the author of somehow, either directly or indirectly - and yet once again... there's no evidence for that.

EvF

(October 19, 2009 at 8:58 am)theVOID Wrote: Mostly, but i don't think it is that black and white; some people wish to be treated with a respect they have not earned. Respect does not come by default, everyone is neutral to begin with and their actions dictate the extend to which i treat them.

Sounds to me like your answer is really no. The golden rule does not have any conditions on what the other persons says or does and it sounds to me like your treatment of others is conditional, e.g., you will treat another like you want to be treated as long as they first earn your respect. Please clarify if you like. Also, I was not asking whether you always actually follow the golden rule I was merely asking whether or not you agree with the golden rule standard and strive to follow it.

I don't know if I agree with the Golden rule, certainly not the way Jesus puts it. I think it should more appropriately be treat people the way they want to be treated, and they should do the same, since some people have different standards of what is appropriate treatment. Also, for more on my thoughts on morality, you can read this: http://www.examiner.com/x-8776-Boston-At...ng-of-Life I know I link to my examiner.com articles a lot, but honestly, sometimes it's easier then trying to type out thoughts again that you've expressed elsewhere.

(October 19, 2009 at 9:17 am)rjh4 Wrote:

(October 19, 2009 at 8:58 am)theVOID Wrote: Mostly, but i don't think it is that black and white; some people wish to be treated with a respect they have not earned. Respect does not come by default, everyone is neutral to begin with and their actions dictate the extend to which i treat them.

Sounds to me like your answer is really no. The golden rule does not have any conditions on what the other persons says or does and it sounds to me like your treatment of others is conditional, e.g., you will treat another like you want to be treated as long as they first earn your respect. Please clarify if you like. Also, I was not asking whether you always actually follow the golden rule I was merely asking whether or not you agree with the golden rule standard and strive to follow it.

And i am telling you that i don't entirely and why. I treat everyone as i would like to be treated until i have a reason not to. Would i treat a murderer as i would like to be treated? No - They don't deserve to be treated with that level of respect, and likewise, if i have done something horrible i don't expect to be treated as a decent person, that is the consequence of my action.

(October 19, 2009 at 9:34 am)Eilonnwy Wrote: I don't know if I agree with the Golden rule, certainly not the way Jesus puts it. I think it should more appropriately be treat people the way they want to be treated, and they should do the same, since some people have different standards of what is appropriate treatment.[...]

I completely agree, and I was gonna say something like that but didn't know how to put it.

But I think it works okay as a general rule, so long as you understand people are different.

Like it's important to recognize that everyone's tastes are different and we are all individuals, but the Golden Rule can help as a general rule perhaps.

EvF

(October 19, 2009 at 9:34 am)Eilonnwy Wrote: I don't know if I agree with the Golden rule, certainly not the way Jesus puts it. I think it should more appropriately be treat people the way they want to be treated, and they should do the same, since some people have different standards of what is appropriate treatment. Also, for more on my thoughts on morality, you can read this: http://www.examiner.com/x-8776-Boston-At...ng-of-Life I know I link to my examiner.com articles a lot, but honestly, sometimes it's easier then trying to type out thoughts again that you've expressed elsewhere.

Actually, I was asking about the golden rule as set forth in the quote from the BHA website, not as Jesus put it (to be honest, I clearly did not read carefully enough because I initially thought they were the same but after reading your post and rereading the quote, I see they are not). As presented in that quote, it would seem to match what you said. Do you agree?

I strive not to negatively influence those around me. That said, I still do go out of my way to do positive things in varying degrees(smiling to a stranger, buying a meal for the homeless, giving to charity, etc).

I agree that "the golden rule" is something that developed in humans naturally. You can even see that sort of behavior reflected in wild animals, to a lesser extent.