Quote:2:99
And indeed We have sent down to you manifest Ayat (these Verses of the Quran which inform in detail about the news of the Jews and their secret intentions, etc.), and none disbelieve in them but Fasiqun (those who rebel against Allah's Command).

just asking any muslims, what does this mean.

(January 11, 2013 at 4:20 pm)paulpablo Wrote:

Quote:2:99
And indeed We have sent down to you manifest Ayat (these Verses of the Quran which inform in detail about the news of the Jews and their secret intentions, etc.), and none disbelieve in them but Fasiqun (those who rebel against Allah's Command).

just asking any muslims, what does this mean.

That is a loaded question.

Sorry if my post makes this short for you, but what you will run into if any Muslim does answer it will be what ever they want it to mean.

All holy books are constantly fought over even within. You can get a ton of different answers and everyone telling you what the verse means will have different answers and every single individual will say " I got the right interpretation".

I think it is a bad idea to single out any single holy book because every religion does this and you will always have even within them, different answers because different sects have different interpretations and different agendas.

A Muslim in America who is secular and liberal is not going to see that verse say, the same way an Imam in Iraq will. Much less a Palestinian.

I'll step aside for now, just warning you what you are in for.

yeh but this is whats so good about talking with religious people like christopher hitchens said, you never know what they are going to say next. Its watching them squirm and trying to manipulate words that i enjoy.

Yea, it's like exposing the 3 card Monty scam on a Vegas street corner.

Hey, im back will reply after some sleep.

---

As i havnt fully researched this i don't fully know. But i can give a quick answer after doing a little bit of research.

A large portion of Surah Al-baqarah addresses the Children of Israel, the Jewish nation, verse 40-120.

This verse addresses the jews. As i'm no scholar or Sheik i will take exerts from Tafsir's.

Tafsir Ibn Kathir:

Allah says;
وَلَقَدْ أَنزَلْنَآ إِلَيْكَ آيَاتٍ بَيِّنَاتٍ وَمَا يَكْفُرُ بِهَا إِلاَّ الْفَاسِقُونَ ﴿٩٩﴾
And indeed We have sent down to you manifest Ayat and none disbelieve in them but Fasiqun (those who rebel against Allah's command).
Imam Abu Jafar bin Jarir said that Allah's statement, وَلَقَدْ أَنزَلْنَآ إِلَيْكَ آيَاتٍ بَيِّنَاتٍ (And indeed We have sent down to you manifest Ayat) means,
"We have sent to you, O Muhammad, clear signs that testify to your Prophethood.''
These Ayat are contained in the Book of Allah (Qur'an) which narrates the secrets of the knowledge that the Jews possess, which they hid, and the stories of their earlier generations.
The Book of Allah also mentions the texts in the Books of the Jews that are known to only the rabbis and scholars, and the sections where they altered and distorted the rulings of the Tawrah. Since Allah mentioned all of this in His Book revealed to His Prophet Muhammad, then this fact alone should be enough evidence for those who are truthful with themselves and who wish to avoid bringing themselves to destruction due to envy and transgression.
Further human instinct testifies to the truth that Muhammad was sent with and the clear signs that he brought which he did not learn or acquire from mankind.
Ad-Dahhak said that Ibn Abbas said that, وَلَقَدْ أَنزَلْنَآ إِلَيْكَ آيَاتٍ بَيِّنَاتٍ (And indeed We have sent down to you manifest Ayat) means,
"You recite and convey this Book to them day and night, although you are an Ummi (unlettered) who never read a book. Yet, you inform them of what they have (in their own Books). Allah stated that this fact should serve as an example, a clear sign and a proof against them, if they but knew.''


In short the Jewish people of Medina were shown clear signs of Muhammads prophethood. Some accepted. Some rejected.

I will look more into it. But i have to grab some sleep.

If you excuse me, Arabic is my native language & I understand every tiny bit in the Quran.

The "Ayat" or "Aya" or if translated by meaning it would be (sign, signs of god), signs that proves the existence of god. The aya or the sign is everywhere, the Quran states in a lot of locations that humans themselves, are signs of god, the night the day...etc, the Quran is one of the signs.

So, the Jews knew that Mohammad was a real prophet, they knew that what he says is not strange to them ; hence some of them knew that the Quran was truly from god. So, the ones who didn't believe in it are "faseqoon", faseq means (a person who crossed god's red lines), in many areas.

(January 19, 2013 at 8:33 pm)AtlasS Wrote: If you excuse me, Arabic is my native language & I understand every tiny bit in the Quran.

The "Ayat" or "Aya" or if translated by meaning it would be (sign, signs of god), signs that proves the existence of god. The aya or the sign is everywhere, the Quran states in a lot of locations that humans themselves, are signs of god, the night the day...etc, the Quran is one of the signs.

So, the Jews knew that Mohammad was a real prophet, they knew that what he says is not strange to them ; hence some of them knew that the Quran was truly from god. So, the ones who didn't believe in it are "faseqoon", faseq means (a person who crossed god's red lines), in many areas.

Yea it is not nice to cross the godfather. You kiss his ring or he'll give you "special treatment".

(January 19, 2013 at 10:48 pm)Brian37 Wrote: Yea it is not nice to cross the godfather. You kiss his ring or he'll give you "special treatment".

The idea of being a servant is unimaginably painful & sad..but the problem is : what does servant mean ?

With humans, yes, being a mere pawn, a servant, is one the most devastating things. But that goes for humans only..

God is not human. Being a servant for god is something totally different than being a servant to a human being ; like you & me .

Have you ever seen a master, an enslaver, who leaves his slaves roaming freely without any intervention for thousands of years ??

Worshiping "god" is not worshiping a human, that's according to Islam.

Surah 112:4

وَ لَمۡ یَکُنۡ لَّهّ کُفُوًا اَحَدٌ

Walam yakul-la-Huu kufuwan 'ahad.

Sahih International
Nor is there to Him any equivalent."
Muhsin Khan
"And there is none co-equal or comparable unto Him."
Pickthall
And there is none comparable unto Him.
Yusuf Ali
And there is none like unto Him.
Shakir
And none is like Him.
Dr. Ghali
And to Him none could be co-equal."

وَلَقَدْ أَنزَلْنَا إِلَيْكَ آيَاتٍ بَيِّنَاتٍ وَمَا يَكْفُرُ بِهَا إِلاَّ الْفَاسِقُونَ


simply ... He knows people won't believe him

so he stated to them already