(November 5, 2009 at 8:24 am)Pippy Wrote:

Quote:we are seeing evolution in action

Hey also Padraic, good to see you again. I have to say that I hate that term. One of the fundamentals of evolution is large scale time lapse, so almost nothing we can see in our lives has much of an effect on evolution.

Well yes and no. What you would actually see is natural selection at work, those that are less prone to get sick of the swine flu will have a better chance at survival and procreation than those that don't. That is also an integral part of evolution.

(November 5, 2009 at 5:02 am)Tiberius Wrote: Bird flu was over-hyped by the media, but swine flu really isn't being. A bird flu outbreak relied on the strain mutating so it could infect humans; the H1N1 virus can already infect humans, hence the panic and the mass producing of vaccines.

The 2004_H5N1 virus was barely overhyped by the media because that was a drug resistant strain, if it had mutated to humans (not that difficult for it to have done), it would have killed the majority of people who got it. Fortunately it did not mutate to be respratory, and jump from human to human, but there was very little we could do for the few people who got it because of its drug resistance.

Hey,

Quote:What you would actually see is natural selection at work,

Yes, of course.

Quote:That is also an integral part of evolution.

Yes, also true.

I just felt obliged to point out that other than in some "social evolution" abstract, deciding not to take the Pandremix inoculation has nothing at all to do with evolution. The two exist on absolutely different scales. In fact, getting this inoculation for this flu in this situation likely has negligible bearing on anyone's ability to pass on the genes that allowed them to make such a decision, if in fact that can even be selected for. One thing I agree with Dawkins about is the mis-use of evolutionary theory and concepts.

I don't mean to be a stickler though, I quite like Padraics input and he knows that.

Thanks,
-Pip

People are getting retarded about it here. On one hand, there are tin-foil hat loonies saying it's a government conspiracy to either kill or brainwash people. On the other hand, perfectly healthy people are lining up en masse and making it difficult for the prioritized people to get their shots. There were 4 hour waits during the peak.

My 19 year old sister-in-law has cancer and is going through chemo, her doctor told her she should get it, and because she has a weakened immune system, she's considered high-priority. She went to the clinic, faced hour-long lineups (in a crowded public place, the last place a chemo patient wants to be), and got turned away due to shortages.

She ended up jumping the line after they got on local news, but it's still a really fucked up situation.

Edit: Not to mention our government inexplicitly playing the race card, and saying Aboriginal people are considered priority. What the fuck is that?

Sorry to hear about your sister-in-law Meatball. I agree its fucked up.

(November 5, 2009 at 3:13 pm)Meatball Wrote: Edit: Not to mention our government inexplicitly playing the race card, and saying Aboriginal people are considered priority. What the fuck is that?

hock:

Did the government give any reason why?

Hi Everyone,

I am going to discuss some important tips for swine flu. I am sharing some home remedies to avoid swine flu.

1. Have five duly washed leaves of Tulsi (known as Basil in English; medicinal name Ocimum sanctum) everyday in the morning. Tulsi has a large number of therapeutic properties. It keeps throat and lungs clear and helps in infections by way of strengthening your immunity.

2. Giloi (medicinal name Tinospora cordifolia) is a commonly available plant in many areas. Take a one-foot long branch of giloi, add five to six leaves of Tulsi and boil in water for 15-20 minutes or long enough to allow the water to extract its properties. Add black pepper and sendha (salt used during religious fasts), rock or black salt, or Misri (crystalised sugar like lumps to make it sweet) according to taste. Let it cool a bit and drink this kadha (concoction) while still warm. It will work wonders for your immunity. If giloi plant is not available, get processed giloi powder from Hamdard or others, and concoct a similar drink once a day.

3. A small piece of camphor approximately the size of a tablet should be taken once or twice a month. It can be swallowed with water by adults while children can take it along with mashed potatoes or banana because they will find it difficult to have it without any aides. Please remember camphor is not to be taken everyday, but only once each season, or once a month.

4. Those who can take garlic, must have two pods of raw garlic first thing in the morning. To be swallowed daily with lukewarm water. Garlic too strengthens immunity like the earlier measures mentioned.

5. Those not allergic to milk, must take a glass of hot or lukewarm milk every night with a small measure of haldi (turmeric).

6. Aloe vera (gwarpatha) too is a commonly available plant. Its thick and long, cactus-like leaves have an odourless gel. A teaspoon gel taken with water daily can work wonders for not only your skin and joint pains, but also boost immunity.

7. Take homeopathic medicines — Pyrogenium 200 and Inflenzium 200 in particular — five tablets three times a day, or two-three drops three times a day. While these are not specifically targeted at H1N1 either, these work well as preventive against common flu virus.

8. Do Pranayam daily (preferably under guidance if you are already not initiated into it) and go for morning jog/walk regularly to keep your throat and lungs in good condition and body in fine fettle. Even in small measures, it will work wonders for your body’s resistance against all such diseases which attack the nose, throat and lungs, besides keeping you fit.

9. Have citrus fruits, particularly Vitamin C rich Amla (Indian gooseberry) juice. Since fresh Amla is not yet available in the market (not for another three to four months), it is not a bad idea to buy packaged Amla juice which is commonly available nowadays.

10. Last but not the least, wash your hands frequently every day with soap and warm water for 15-20 seconds; especially before meals, or each time after touching a surface that you suspect could be contaminated with flu virus such as a door handle or a knob/handle, especially if you have returned from a public place or used public transport. Alcohol-based hand cleaners should be kept handy at all times and used until you can get soap and warm water.

robetjems, do you perhaps have any evidence to support the efficacy of any of your so-called remedies? With the exception of hand washing, your suggestions are just silly claims made by alternative medicine that have been proven time and again to have no effect, or at the very least no better than placebo.

(November 5, 2009 at 3:18 pm)leo-rcc Wrote: Sorry to hear about your sister-in-law Meatball. I agree its fucked up.

(November 5, 2009 at 3:13 pm)Meatball Wrote: Edit: Not to mention our government inexplicitly playing the race card, and saying Aboriginal people are considered priority. What the fuck is that?

hock:

Did the government give any reason why?

Not that I've seen. I have no idea why this isn't a bigger issue.

The government of Canada says that people in remote, rural areas are considered priority, which includes a lot of aboriginals on reserves, who have had a few outbreaks already. Why the Government of Manitoba came out and said anyone of aboriginal ancestry is priority is beyond me.

I think I'm going to write a letter.

Link, if you're interested.

(November 5, 2009 at 3:18 pm)leo-rcc Wrote: Sorry to hear about your sister-in-law Meatball. I agree its fucked up.

(November 5, 2009 at 3:13 pm)Meatball Wrote: Edit: Not to mention our government inexplicitly playing the race card, and saying Aboriginal people are considered priority. What the fuck is that?

hock:

Did the government give any reason why?

As a group Aboriginal people are in poorer general health than the rest of the community,with higher per capita levels of such things as alcoholism, diabetes and renal disease.They also have higher rates of infection from contagious diseases. The life expectancy of Aboriginal people in Australia is 10-15 years less than the rest of the community.

Quote:Aboriginal health issues



Aboriginal people have higher rates of ill health than any other group in Australia. The Australian Bureau of Statistics (ABS) estimates that there are between 418,800 and 476,900 indigenous people in Australia. Of all the States and Territories, Victoria has the lowest number of indigenous people, accounting for only 0.5 per cent of the population. Compared to Aboriginal people living in other parts of Australia, the Victorian Koori population reports the highest rates of recent illness (53.4%), chronic illness (46.3%) and cigarette smoking (57.1%). According to the Victorian Aboriginal Health Service, some of the main health issues confronting Koori people include smoking, diet, diseases (such as cardiovascular disease, diabetes and high blood pressure), stress, drugs, alcohol and poor children’s health.

http://www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au/bhcv2...lth_issues

I'm in Canada, but to be honest it's a similar situation.

My problem is that most of these health problems stem from poverty issues, and not race. There is no scientific evidence that people of aboriginal ancestry are more susceptible to H1N1.