(March 16, 2014 at 5:50 pm)philonehalf Wrote: If you are looking for true peace you must free yourself from the idea that you need to believe in a higher power, then you will see that it is actually men that cause the problems, but also men that can solve them! Men and women are capable of many good things and many bad things without even bringing the idea of god into existence.

I agree humans create these problems and can solve them, but why must I free myself from the idea that I need to believe in a higher power to find true peace? Yes humans can do good without belief in God, not to sure why you are saying I should stop believing in God because of that.

Because belief in gods can cause more problems than they solve. Especially if it's a religion that fosters an Us vs Them mentality like the Abrahamic religions do.

(March 2, 2014 at 1:33 pm)Chad32 Wrote: You only get forgiven if you prostrate yourself to the right deity.

And this goes for all religions which puts people in a no win situation.

(March 16, 2014 at 5:59 pm)Chad32 Wrote: Because belief in gods can cause more problems than they solve. Especially if it's a religion that fosters an Us vs Them mentality like the Abrahamic religions do.

Any idea that has people united arounded can foster us vs them mentality. Religion at least goes beyond the ethnic or nationalistic divisions and unites people on something beyond region or ethnicity.

The God idea unites most of humanity on a commonality - the belief in a cosmic creator that is worthy of worship. The details - well - I think the devil is in the details.

(March 16, 2014 at 5:56 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:

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(March 16, 2014 at 5:50 pm)philonehalf Wrote: If you are looking for true peace you must free yourself from the idea that you need to believe in a higher power, then you will see that it is actually men that cause the problems, but also men that can solve them! Men and women are capable of many good things and many bad things without even bringing the idea of god into existence.

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I agree humans create these problems and can solve them, but why must I free myself from the idea that I need to believe in a higher power to find true peace? Yes humans can do good without belief in God, not to sure why you are saying I should stop believing in God because of that.

Since all gods are imaginary create one that suits your purpose and has all of the qualities that you want your god to have. And then you will be happy. There's no reason to believe in someone else's imaginary god when you can create your own to your specifications.

(March 16, 2014 at 6:07 pm)Wyrd of Gawd Wrote:

(March 16, 2014 at 5:56 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:

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I agree humans create these problems and can solve them, but why must I free myself from the idea that I need to believe in a higher power to find true peace? Yes humans can do good without belief in God, not to sure why you are saying I should stop believing in God because of that.

Since all gods are imaginary create one that suits your purpose and has all of the qualities that you want your god to have. And then you will be happy. There's no reason to believe in someone else's imaginary god when you can create your own to your specifications.

Well let's take the issue of morality. We don't know for certain if our moral judgements are all what we should have. We maybe wrong and even contradicting some of our first principle and often being hypocritical in moral judgements we have without realizing it.

Humans in general differ with morality even if we agree on much of it.

God means a being that is ultimately great. While humans may differ with respect what it means to be ultimately great, they do tend to agree on much of what it means to be ultimately great.

Ultimate greatness - I may be wrong - in what it means to be that, but I think I do have a sense of what is greatness and have some sort of idea of what the ultimate being is.

Also, just because morality has been misconstructed by bad leaders often, it doesn't do away with there being a good moral sense with humans.

The same is true of spirituality and God. Just because we have misconstructed God often, it doesn't mean there is no sense of him at all or that it's a totally random idea we have when we think of God.

(March 16, 2014 at 5:56 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:

(March 16, 2014 at 5:50 pm)philonehalf Wrote: If you are looking for true peace you must free yourself from the idea that you need to believe in a higher power, then you will see that it is actually men that cause the problems, but also men that can solve them! Men and women are capable of many good things and many bad things without even bringing the idea of god into existence.

I agree humans create these problems and can solve them, but why must I free myself from the idea that I need to believe in a higher power to find true peace? Yes humans can do good without belief in God, not to sure why you are saying I should stop believing in God because of that.

I personally don't care what you believe, as long as I don't have to hear about it, and you don't use it to support arguments, prejudices, ethics, morals, or anything else.

It is simply that peace is hard to come by when you deal with anything past 'the self' in organised religions. You may not like it, but by identifying yourself with a religion or 'god' you also link yourself to others who may not act or think in the same peaceful way you do, or have done in the past. Many of the worst acts in history were committed in the name of religion. These beliefs inspire 'extreme' actions because the beliefs themselves are extreme and require you to 'step outside' what you can prove and enter the world of faith. I enjoy meeting people like yourself who are open minded and have faith because they want to find peace, there are many who have other motives and are ultimately intolerant.

(March 16, 2014 at 5:56 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: (...)but why must I free myself from the idea that I need to believe in a higher power to find true peace?

You don't need to, but if you care about what is true and what you can demonstrate to others, such sillyness as gods will make no sense.

If you wish to hold a confortable delusion instead of an harsh reality, its your perrogative, I won't stop you, but I prefer a bitch of a reality than a confortable thought any day.

(March 16, 2014 at 6:30 pm)LastPoet Wrote:

(March 16, 2014 at 5:56 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: (...)but why must I free myself from the idea that I need to believe in a higher power to find true peace?

You don't need to, but if you care about what is true and what you can demonstrate to others, such sillyness as gods will make no sense.

If you wish to hold a confortable delusion instead of an harsh reality, its your perrogative, I won't stop you, but I prefer a bitch of a reality than a confortable thought any day.

Many of the things are not provable by analysis unless we agree upon some axioms. There are other things which are known by experience or innately and are simply to be reminded about or when spoken about, reveal what we innately know or have experienced.

I do care about what it is true. If I was convinced I was deluding myself into thinking God exists, I would not be able to think/believe God exists.