(August 18, 2014 at 10:45 am)Michael Wrote: Arhgg. I hadn't thought about that. The webcams. They're looking at me through the webcams!!

I better go and put some clothes on.

No, don't! Why do you think I set up the cameras in the first place~

(August 18, 2014 at 4:45 am)Esquilax Wrote: Case in point, we've had more than one muslim here who was convinced that mainstream science was an enormous conspiracy founded to keep down islamic truths in favor of evolution. How do you argue against a position like that?

(August 18, 2014 at 10:45 am)Michael Wrote: Arhgg. I hadn't thought about that. The webcams. They're looking at me through the webcams!!

I better go and put some clothes on.

You! You will wait for Losty's permission to do any such thing!

Isn't it illegal to discuss politics in churches? If it's not it definitely should be.

(August 18, 2014 at 11:21 am)Losty Wrote: Isn't it illegal to discuss politics in churches? If it's not it definitely should be.

It's one hell of a murky grey-ish area. For a long time there've been laws against endorsing political figures in churches (calling for donations, raising support for, etc), but it's only very recently that the IRS has agreed to actually enforce those laws (with cries of persecution coming from the Christian Right...shocker).

But 'discussing' politics? I dunno. If a preacher mentions a news story or a policy decision or something, I don't think that's too bad. But yeah, grey area.

Ok sure mentioning it is fine...I guess...kind of. I just hate that churches don't pay taxes and they still get to influence how people vote. If you're you're going to dicuss politics at church, then your church needs to be paying taxes.
(If you're not discussing politics your church should still pay taxes IMO)

(August 18, 2014 at 11:27 am)Losty Wrote: Ok sure mentioning it is fine...I guess...kind of. I just hate that churches don't pay taxes and they still get to influence how people vote. If you're you're going to dicuss politics at church, then your church needs to be paying taxes.
(If you're not discussing politics your church should still pay taxes IMO)

That's what the recent IRS statements were about I believe. The fact that churches are tax-exempt puts severe restrictions on the type of political speech they can perform. Those laws had been there for a long time, they're just starting to enforce them now (or at least they say they're going to enforce them).

(August 17, 2014 at 8:31 pm)christianatheist Wrote: Disclaimer:
When I say christians, I am refering to the hardcore "I'm right your wrong" christians.
All the other christians, you rock!
Forcing religion on people is when a religion becomes intolerable.
End disclaimer
I still attend church, because I still need the help and support of my family. I also attend Bible study.
All in all, I go to church about three-four times a week.
One trend I've started noticing is that christians seem to largely be more Paranoid than other groups.
All the bible study I attend ever talks about is how the government is out to get christians, and how the whole world is conspiring against them.
My father, who is a pastor, often comments along these lines in daily conversation.
Two bible studies ago, an old man in the church leans over and wispers,
"Why has nobody tried to assassinate Obama yet?"
That's definitely the love of god, eh?
Anyway, I want to know if anyone else here has scene the Paranoia I mentioned among this particular group.

Q. How do you know when an aircraft full of Christians has landed?

A. They turn the engines off but the whining doesn't stop.

MM

On faith, church and politics, that's a heady combination! But in England it was that mix that drove, in a sadly violent and bloody way, the introduction of democracy in the British civil wars. It drove the establishment of the trade unions, and the introduction of the welfare state. It drove the introduction of the Children's Act which protected children from harsh labour and ensured they had a rudimentary education. It drove the anti-slavery movement, and then gave the emancipated people a voice (they could use the Bible themselves, and learned how to do it powerfully). In England it was the churches (and especially the non-conformist ones) that drove social changes very much for the better. It even inspired Mary Wollstonecraft to begin what would later be known as the 'feminist' movement. It's hard to imagine what England would have been like without people first being empowered by the bible in English, and then by taking those positions of faith into the parliament they fought, died and killed for, and then into the cities which had fallen into a desperate state of poverty and slum conditions. Politics and faith can be a good mix, especially when in the hands of the ordinary people.

Quote:How do you argue against a position like that?

Throw rocks? Oh, wait. That's their trick.