(September 27, 2014 at 2:24 am)psychoslice Wrote:

(September 27, 2014 at 1:28 am)Surgenator Wrote: Where are the arguments for these claims? I can make counter arguments for these claims. For example, our lungs do not extend outwards to trees. Our lungs are made out of cells, and non of our cells are make a connection to a tree.

I have no arguments, this is simply my experience, my truth, you don't need to prove truth, if you don't agree with me then that's fine, that's how it should be.

There is no your truth and my truth. Truth is not subjective to a persons will or ideals.
So you need arguments for what you claim is truth.

(September 27, 2014 at 2:39 am)Pickup_shonuff Wrote:

(September 27, 2014 at 2:33 am)Pickup_shonuff Wrote: Well, there's certainly Nietzsche's interesting conception of the "Eternal Recurrence" that seems logically necessary given infinite time, but I admit I fail to see any logic in infinities.

I think the more interesting point is, if say, the entire Universe as it presently is were to repeat itself at some future point, and this conversation were to occur again between two people with identical compositions in the exact same time and space, in precise proportionality to the rest of the Universe, say even, that at this very moment this re-occurrence is taking place, in what sense is it really meaningful to speak of these past or future selves of ours as actually us? I certainly feel no affinity to any other so-called past lives.

True. I don't feel any sort of affinity to any so-called past lives either. But I guess the point in which I trail off on the idea of the universe repeating itself, is because of it being my random life in the infinite future of a universe with exact compositions and proportions and so on, if I can't have any sort of affinity towards it, can I on some intrinsic level impact or affect that life somewhere in the infinite?

(September 27, 2014 at 2:41 am)Surgenator Wrote:

(September 27, 2014 at 2:24 am)psychoslice Wrote: I have no arguments, this is simply my experience, my truth, you don't need to prove truth, if you don't agree with me then that's fine, that's how it should be.

There is no your truth and my truth. Truth is not subjective to a persons will or ideals.
So you need arguments for what you claim is truth.

That's right, there is no my truth verses your truth, there is just truth, you can only experience this truth, you cannot conceptualize and argue over it, because then its no longer truth, and that's the tooth lol.

(September 27, 2014 at 2:37 am)Surgenator Wrote:

(September 27, 2014 at 2:21 am)Hezekiah Wrote: No, sorry, I'm not suggesting we have percieved the universe from the beginning up until now. What we percieve from the time we are born to the time we die, is a fixed length that lies along the timeline of the universe, but, like I mentioned before it's just a spec, no where near the beginning of the birth of the universe. We have NOT percieved it from its beginning to now.

Now when you said, "Space and us are in the same timeline. We are just born later and die earlier while space continues on existing." I agree. I am simply implying that if, like you also said, "time will continue to exist to infinity" and anything that goes into infinity, including the timeline of which we were born and died, turns into zero as well, as if it never existed.

No, our timeline doesn't turn into zero. If I am alive for 100 years, then I lived 100 years no matter how much time passes after my death. The ratio of the length of my existence and the universe's existence will approch zero. However, I don't see why this relevant to the original discussion about consciousness.

This was all in discussion over one of my sub-point for why consciousness might be seperate from the body, which was, "time may not exist if it is all according to how fast the brain can process whats going on". I was suggesting that if, how you said, "The ratio of the length of my existence and the universe's existence will approch zero" then would time necessarily exist if things continued on forever and just always was?

(September 27, 2014 at 2:49 am)Hezekiah Wrote: True. I don't feel any sort of affinity to any so-called past lives either. But I guess the point in which I trail off on the idea of the universe repeating itself, is because of it being my random life in the infinite future of a universe with exact compositions and proportions and so on, if I can't have any sort of affinity towards it, can I on some intrinsic level impact or affect that life somewhere in the infinite?

I think the most sensible, that is simple and obvious answer, really mulling it over and considering what the future entails, and given the numerous past lives whom, as Ecclesiasticus 44:9 poetically describes, "have no memorial; who are perished, as though they had never been; and are become as though they had never been born; and their children after them," is, no.

(September 27, 2014 at 3:04 am)Pickup_shonuff Wrote:

(September 27, 2014 at 2:49 am)Hezekiah Wrote: True. I don't feel any sort of affinity to any so-called past lives either. But I guess the point in which I trail off on the idea of the universe repeating itself, is because of it being my random life in the infinite future of a universe with exact compositions and proportions and so on, if I can't have any sort of affinity towards it, can I on some intrinsic level impact or affect that life somewhere in the infinite?

I think the most sensible, that is simple and obvious answer, really mulling it over and considering what the future entails, and given the numerous past lives whom, as Ecclesiasticus 44:9 poetically describes, "have no memorial; who are perished, as though they had never been; and are become as though they had never been born; and their children after them," is, no.

Hmm. I think I agree with you there. Really, depending on your stance, the only thing that can effect something like that would be chance/God.

Consciousness can be altered by altering the brain. When the brain stops working or disappears altogether, consciousness vanishes.
If consciousness is separate from the body, it's doing a piss-poor job at it.

(September 26, 2014 at 11:58 pm)Hezekiah Wrote: Lately I've been fascinated with the idea of consciousness. I've been reading a bit on quantum physics,

Wrong place to look for consciousness.

(September 26, 2014 at 11:58 pm)Hezekiah Wrote: and have come to the idea that the conscious state of mind is completely seperate from the brain.

In the same way that software is separate from hardware.

(September 26, 2014 at 11:58 pm)Hezekiah Wrote: 1) I feel as though I am not my body. For instance, if I cut my own hand off, my hand is no longer me, I'm still in the larger portion of my own body (of course I know that's mainly because my brain is still communicating with the rest of my body).

You are not your body. You are a process occurring in a specific part of your body (the brain).

(September 26, 2014 at 11:58 pm)Hezekiah Wrote: 2) It takes the brain roughly 80 milliseconds to process new stimulus, including getting that information to the brain via the nervous system. Which introduces the idea that time may not exist if it is all according to how fast the brain can process whats going on.

So, a temporal attribute of mental process indicated that the mental process is atemporal? Really?

(September 26, 2014 at 11:58 pm)Hezekiah Wrote: 3) Finally, there are all types of optical, tactile and auditory illusions that can play tricks on the brain. We can only perceive our world through our senses, even certain animals can percieve colors invisible to the naked eye. Which, too me, all says that the brain is a magnificent instrument, but is not perfect.

And what does perfection have to do with it?

(September 26, 2014 at 11:58 pm)Hezekiah Wrote: And instruments aren't autonomous.

Not yet.

(September 26, 2014 at 11:58 pm)Hezekiah Wrote: What do you all think?

That you've been listening to Deepak Chopra.

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(September 27, 2014 at 12:57 am)Hezekiah Wrote: But when someone dies, their body is left behind, still bound by the laws of gravity and of the universe, but the person is no longer the person who was alive. A dead person is no longer conscious, so where did that consciousness go?

Where does the flame go when you blow out the candle? To the Great Fire in the Sky?

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(September 27, 2014 at 1:11 am)psychoslice Wrote: We were never really born and we cannot really die, the mind body organism dies and is born, but we are not the mind body organism. When I say we, I mean we as one, so its not really plural, even to say that we are one isn't correct, for that makes it sound like there is more than one. Like our lungs, they don't really just stop in our bodies, they extend outward, they are one with the tree's where the oxygen comes from, the tree's are one with the sun where they get their sunlight to be able to produce oxygen, and so it goes on and on right back to the so called beginning, or the big bang, yes its all One.

LSD? Why, thank you. I'll have the stuff he's on.

"We are the Universe, pondering itself." -- Freeman Dyson

Quote:Consciousness: Is it seperate from the human body?

I don't know how it works for humans but we rounded rectangles keep our conciousness in our rounded off corners which reside in another dimension. We call it the rounded off corner dimension.