(January 13, 2015 at 9:32 pm)Roxy904 Wrote: . . . Any general advice for high school, which may or may not be Catholic?Thanks for taking the time to read this long post.

Oh, kiddo, my heart aches for you. I have three daughters (all in college now) and I cannot imagine putting them through this. Just being a teenager is hard enough without having to fight your way through your parents' Santa Claus fantasy.

Here are a couple of ideas: First, you're not the only one in this particular mess, and you won't be the only agnostic in your school. There are plenty of other kids in the same boat. You need to seek them out and band together. It's easier to laugh off the crap when you've got someone to laugh with.

Second, try not to buck the system too hard. It's not worth it. No matter how clueless she might seem, your Mom loves you like crazy. It might seem like forever today, but in 5 short years you will be legally an adult, and you'll be able to make your own rules.

Right now you don't have a choice in the matter, so make the best of it. A lot of catholic schools are excellent academically, and they really can't force you to believe - just to go through the motions. So take the good and leave the drek behind. And spend as much time as you can on forums like this, and with friends who also ask the right questions and refuse the wrong answers.

meanwhile, here's a silly joke: A transvestite guy in full drag decides to check out a Catholic Church on Sunday morning, just out of curiosity. It's a full traditional Mass, and pretty soon a Priest comes walking down the aisle, swinging a censer full of incense. As the Priest passes the pew where the transvestite is sitting, the TV leans over and says in a loud whisper:

"Love the dress, sweetie - but your purse is on fire!"

(January 13, 2015 at 10:12 pm)DeadChannel Wrote: Oh, and I'm totally willing to nerd out on Orwell or any of his contemporaries whenever. I'm reading "Homage to Catalonia" right now, which is Orwell's first hand account of the time he spent during the Spanish civil war. It's very informative, but also a total breeze to read. Worth checking out if you haven't already.

Oh, thanks; I'll check it out. I actually just started reading Animal Farm.*high five for reading*

---

(January 13, 2015 at 10:20 pm)Tonus Wrote: I admire anyone who can figure this stuff out as young as you did. Not because it's rare, but because it took me considerably longer to see what was staring me in the face for so many years.

(January 13, 2015 at 9:32 pm)Roxy904 Wrote: I could see that she was hurt by this, and she genuinely is a very good mother.

That is one of the ways that religion harms people. It is driving a wedge between you and your mother because her belief system is inflexible, as religious beliefs can often be. In lieu of showing you why her beliefs are true and convincing you that she is right, she must use emotion and indignation to try to guilt you into toeing the line.

You are in a tough spot because of your age, but I think that since the cat is out of the bag you should continue to try to discuss the issue and how you feel. Avoid arguments at any cost, as they are a sure way of letting anger get the best of you and can lead to saying or doing things that you will regret. But be up front with her and give her a chance to explain to you exactly why she believes what she does. Let her expose the weakness of her position and the flimsy foundation for her beliefs.

Trying to fake your way through it seems like a bad idea, since she already knows how you feel and since you probably have four or five years of going through the motions, and that can cause considerably more stress and anxiety than just dealing with it honestly yet cautiously.

---

(January 13, 2015 at 10:12 pm)DeadChannel Wrote: I'm new here too, so I'm still figuring that out. From what I can gather, you can give kudos to posts or people (by going to their profile). Kudos given to a person's profile show up beside their name every time they post. Someone can probably clear that up for you better than I can, though.

You can add a kudos to a post by clicking the little thumbs-up symbol at the bottom of the post in question. That is only for the specific post. You can add to a person's reputation by clicking the "Rate" button at the bottom of the post. That rep is the green number at the upper right, under the person's join date, and applies to the person and not just a specific post.

Thanks for the advice. I really appreciate everyone who contributed. Sometimes, it can feel a little isolated, and it's hard to express my ideas in the 'real world.' So, thanks for helping affirm that I'm not 100% insane.
Thanks again.

---

(January 13, 2015 at 11:30 pm)Davka Wrote: "Love the dress, sweetie - but your purse is on fire!"

Brings a whole new meaning to 'flaming', eh?

Thank you for your kind, well-thought-out answer; I really do love how most people here are so supportive.
You people made my evening, with your jokes, advice, etc.
My thanks to you all.

Welcome, Roxy! It's hard to believe you're only thirteen. One of my closest friends has a twelve-year old whom I love like my own niece, but I can't imagine her thinking as deeply as you do.

Hang in there. You only have a few short years until you're off to do your own thing. Meanwhile, I have no doubt that you're smart enough to figure out what you can take, positively or negatively, from your education. Your mom will come around, even if she is disappointed right now. Just tell her and show her you love her, and I doubt there will be much animosity. It seems like she loves you and has made a point of raising a good, intelligent human; she won't be disappointed.

Hi Roxy!

Many smart things have already been said.
One thought that came to my mind, you be the judge whether it's relevant to you - she says she is disappointed that you reject what she was trying to instill in you. Now, specific beliefs are a very personal thing, does she really want to instill those in you? Or is it more about general values which she wants you to share with her, and which she, in her head, does not clearly separate from details of catholic doctrine because she's not used to doing so? Since she already lives with a man (I assume, your dad) who has quite different beliefs from her, my hope would be that the specifics of catholic faith are actually less important to her than the general christian spirit of compassion, family values etc. which she associates with being catholic. If that were the case, you could let her know that while you have your problems with accepting the truth of all these specifics of her faith, God, virgin Mary and the saints, what have you, that she has taught you a lot of other things about being a good person along the way, and that doesn't change even if you're not exactly in line with everything catholic doctrine tells you. Of course I'm bending over backwards here, because I think much of Christianity, and in particular Catholicism is toxic and actually a hindrance for acting ethically, but that's maybe a topic for some other time.

Now, concerning private catholic HS - it very much depends on which one and where it is, but with a bit of luck you can get an excellent education there, and no abuse. If you're unlucky... well...

Hi Roxy and welcome! Good job calling out the Catholic church for the steaming pile of bullshit it is. You're actually very good, when I was 9-10 years old I loved going to church :eyeroll:

Something I really like about you is your attitude: read a lot, question everything. Of course, not everyone approves of it. Coming from an old fart like me (I'm 20 ), the next 5 years are going to be the longest of your life. High school feels like a bloody eternity. But I don't mean to scare you, mind you... It could be an eternity of bliss!

Anyway, I hope you're planning a long stay here with us. Indeed you look like someone worth keeping

Oh dear, yes it is really sad your mum wants to send you to a faith school even after learning that it means nothing to you. It's totally unfair, but sadly, your mum gets to make these decisions for now.

My advice is to focus on the fact that you are rejecting beliefs, not reject your mum and all the good things she has taught you, religious or otherwise. You are still the same person and love her just as much. The fact that she can offer no rational reason for why you should reconsider your faith just goes to show that it's all made up nonsense. If there was any truth to it, people wouldn't need "faith", which amount to believing things without evidence. It's a sad fact that this has been promoted as a virtue, rather than just gullibility.

So as others have said, hang in there, don't cause arguments unless it's unavoidable then you can do what you like when you're old enough. Good for you for standing up for what you believe and not caving to the pressure. You are very brave I look forward to hearing how things work out for you.

Please bring any questions you have to the forum, we have all sorts of great people here who know lots about many different subjects.

(January 14, 2015 at 3:21 am)Lucanus Wrote: Coming from an old fart like me (I'm 20 ),

Please excuse me for a second while I kill myself

(January 14, 2015 at 3:34 am)Alex K Wrote:

(January 14, 2015 at 3:21 am)Lucanus Wrote: Coming from an old fart like me (I'm 20 ),

Please excuse me for a second while I kill myself

Yes, yes, that's exactly what I meant to happen. Mistress Alice will be pleased...

Thanks for the advice, everyone. I finished filling out my application, which was actually funny to be honest. My strategy: Go a bit over the top with religious crap and see how good their BS detectors are (probably terrible). One essay question asked about a person that impacted my life; I talked about my 3-year-old cousin, because people need to be more like children in accepting, loving, etc. So, everyone, remember be more like 3-year-olds.
Just want to say thanks again for the advice.

I'm guessing that they won't pick up on any BS. Everyone thinking like a three year old would be a great benefit to religion.