Any Nihilists here?

[The Grand Nudger]

Why call a dog a beagle or a great dane? What's the difference, all dogs.

[The Grand Nudger]

If there doesn't seem, to you, to be a difference between nihilism as you understand it and absurdism or existentialism, then you're probably an absurdist or an existentialist.

Existentialists believe that life has whatever value or meaning we create.  Absurdists believe that whatever we value or create and all that exists is...well...absurd, and nihilists believe that life is in vain.

These don't seem mutually exclusive to me.  I'd accept all 3 as true.

Then your worldview is fundamentally incoherent, as well as not being a nihilist one.

[FrustratedFool]

These don't seem mutually exclusive to me.  I'd accept all 3 as true.

Then your worldview is fundamentally incoherent, as well as not being a nihilist one.

I don't believe it is.

Does the universe have any objective meaning itself or within it? No.
Is the universe an absurd brute fact without explanation? Yes.
Does my life have any objective value or meaning or purpose? No.
Can I create or find subjective meanings, values or purposes for my life? Yes.
Are these subjective values and meanings ultimately vain? Yes.

And absurdist, existentialist, and a nihilist would all agree with the above and there are no contradictions.

[FrustratedFool]

Why call a dog a beagle or a great dane? What's the difference, all dogs.

Exactly. Absurdism and existentialism are sub-categories of nihilism. I do not label myself as those sub-categories even though they share the same beliefs.

[The Grand Nudger]

Getting warmer with that last one. Trouble is that explicitly rejects existentialism and an absurdist isn't bound to the claim. The trouble with the last one in itself is the same general inconsistency that nietzsche pointed out. Our inability -to be- nihilists.

The thing that differentiates a nihilist from the other two isn't what they don't believe in, but what they do. Specifically -that- the other two can...coherently, believe in anything at all. Lets try this in terms of pathos. In existentialism, there is meaning, and pathos is the meaning maker. In absurdism, it is the futility of pathos that gives the world it's meaning, which is absurd. In nihilism, there isn't supposed to be any pathos at all.

When I say these things I only mean existentialism/absurdism/nihilism as generally described. Whatever it is that you believe, which could easily be a combination of things and not, strictly speaking, nihilism... may find the distinctions trivial.

(in my experience, obviously an anecdote, "nihilists" are often existentialists and error theorists, this is what they seem to mean when they use the term. )

[The Grand Nudger]

It's a source of amusement to me that the suicide rate among nihilists isn't through the roof.

Boru

LOL.  Nihilism, like pimping, aint easy.  Ultimately, it's a position on apprent value or meaning, and while nihilism rejects those things, for most people, the rejection will only be semantic and intellectual.  They still feel them, they are still apparent.  They're just wrong.

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

Absurdism allows for meaning in life.

So does some forms of nihilism.  Just entirely personal subjective meaning.  Just like existentialism and absurdism (which seem to be off-shoots of nihilism).

As per wiki: "In popular use, the term commonly refers to forms of existential nihilism, according to which life is without intrinsic value, meaning, or purpose. ... Existential nihilism is the position that life has no intrinsic meaning or value.[3] With respect to the universe, existential nihilism posits that a single human or even the entire human species is insignificant, without purpose, and unlikely to change in the totality of existence. The meaninglessness of life is largely explored in the philosophical school of existentialism, where one can create their own subjective meaning or purpose. In popular use, "nihilism" now most commonly refers to forms of existential nihilism."

Note the similarity with the wiki on absurdism: "Absurdism is the philosophical theory that the universe is irrational and meaningless ... Absurdism and nihilism share the belief that life is meaningless."

(Bold mine)

That strikes me as a self-defeating proposition.

Boru

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

An absurdist, an existentialist, and a nihilist walk into a bar. The barman says, ‘What’ll it be?’

The absurdist says, ‘Paris, on the fifth day of asphalt.’

The existentialist says, ‘My feelings about alcohol are more real than the alcohol itself.’

The nihilist says, ‘The crowning cry of a heart’s despair at the emptiness of it all.’

Boru

[FrustratedFool]

@nudger

I don't think you're correct when you state that existentialist and absurdists hold to the idea that one can coherently believe anything at all (and the implied idea that belief is chosen).

But if you are correct, then though that would mean I was incorrect in saying nihilism,absurdism, and existentialism were basically the same, it would mean I was accurate in choosing to labelmyself a nihilist rather than an absurdist or existentialist.

I'm OK with that.

I also want to ask whether your posts are sincere, in that they truly reflect your POV and your attitude, or whether you are playing the role of devil's advocate or gadfly for some reason?

I also notice you have a highly developed subject specific vocabulary and post with confidence. Are you qualified in philosophy perhaps?

[FrustratedFool]

An absurdist, an existentialist, and a nihilist walk into a bar. The barman says, ‘What’ll it be?’

The absurdist says, ‘Paris, on the fifth day of asphalt.’

The existentialist says, ‘My feelings about alcohol are more real than the alcohol itself.’

The nihilist says, ‘The crowning cry of a heart’s despair at the emptiness of it all.’

Boru

Funny. It reminds me of all those jokes about different Christian denominations.

Personally, I'd ask for a pint.