The danger of religion. .

[Tempus]

Atheists killed the most! No, Christians killed the most! What about them Muslims! And those fucking pagans! Oh, look; we're almost at the centre of the Earth - keep digging!

[kılıç_mehmet]

Atheists killed the most! No, Christians killed the most! What about them Muslims! And those fucking pagans! Oh, look; we're almost at the centre of the Earth - keep digging!

Well, people die. But under what context?
I do not blame the christian west for the crusades. They did what they had to do. We did what we had to do in our continuous ghazawat against the christian west.
Were it not for the futuwwat of our grandfathers, brave Ghazis, would we live on the lands we live on today? No.
Obviously, this resulted in bloodshed. Both noble Turkish blood and the blood of the enemy did wet the ground, yet we emerged supreme, and carved out a place for ourselves as an outpost in the west, just behind Hungary, another outpost of the east in western lands.

[Aegrus]

State atheism has been a motivating cause of far more oppression in the last 100 years than Christianity has been.

If you need to cherry pick examples from centuries ago to talk about the "danger of religion" when religious people, on the whole, are more charitable, empathetic and mentally healthy than irreligious, then welp.

To support this, you should give examples. But I'll save you the time.

You might point to Hitler, yet Hitler stated in Mein Kampf that, "by defending myself against the jew, I am fighting for the work of the lord."

http://www.nobeliefs.com/Hitler1.htm

You might point to Pol Pot, but he was Buddhist, and stated that he believed in overriding powers of fate. (A god in everything but name.)

http://www.notablebiographies.com/Pe-Pu/Pol-Pot.html
http://freethoughtpedia.com/wiki/Was_Pol...atheist%3F

You might point to Stalin, but Stalin was a Catholic. Note that the Russian Orthodox Catholic Church flourished under his rule, and he was raised Russian Orthodox, at onepoint considering entering the ranks of the clergy. He was branded as an atheist later by the American government during the same surge of Cold War propaganda which put "in god we trust" on American currency.

http://one-evil.org/people/people_20c_stalin.htm

And either way, atheist leaders who did in fact committ atrocities (such as Mao Zedong) didn't do so because of their atheism. They were not motivated to kill for atheism as certain religious people are motivated to kill for their religion. Atheists can certainly be homicidal murderers, but atheism is not the cause for immoral behaviors.

[Aiza]

To support this, you should give examples. But I'll save you the time.

???

Pick nearly any example off of:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_atheism

If I had to pick one, I think Albania, the "first atheist nation in the world" is interesting.

Your links on Pol Pot are grasping at straws and weird "no true atheist" fallacies. The Khmer Rogue persecuted Buddhists (really anyone expressing religious sentiments).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhism_in..._Rouge_Era
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khmer_Rouge...ommunities

Jsyk....Orthodox Christianity and Catholic Christianity are two different things. There are Russian Orthodox, and Russian Greek Catholics. Stalin was raised the former. But he was very openly atheist and persecuted the Orthodox Christians (who certainly didn't "flourish" though oppression sometimes wavered--between 1927 and 1940, the number of Orthodox Churches in the Russian Republic fell from 29,584 to fewer than 500; though he allowed free practice during WWII as a way of intensifying patriotism).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_Ort...Stalin_era
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USSR_anti-r...%931928%29
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USSR_anti-r...%931941%29
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/League_of_M...t_Atheists

Hitler's religion is under some dispute, as I understand it, though I don't think he was atheist.

[Godscreated]

@ Stimbo, scriptures say do not tempt the LORD thy God. What you described about prayer is tempting God.

[Polaris]

Atheists killed the most! No, Christians killed the most! What about them Muslims! And those fucking pagans! Oh, look; we're almost at the centre of the Earth - keep digging!

Actually, strictly speaking without adding any meaning to the word beyond what it actually means, atheists have killed and continue to kill the most people depending on the year (sometimes religious conflict* is responsible for more deaths in a certain year, sometimes secular strife in another year).

*The US and foreign intervention is responsible for the majority of the high-casualty religious wars though. Sure the Middle East was already a powder-keg full with pent-up tension and frustration, but the US is partially responsible (the USSR was the other instigator) for igniting the fuse.

[Annik]

Actually, strictly speaking without adding any meaning to the word beyond what it actually means, atheists have killed and continue to kill the most people depending on the year (sometimes religious conflict* is responsible for more deaths in a certain year, sometimes secular strife in another year).

*The US and foreign intervention is responsible for the majority of the high-casualty religious wars though. Sure the Middle East was already a powder-keg full with pent-up tension and frustration, but the US is partially responsible (the USSR was the other instigator) for igniting the fuse.

Can I get some figures to back up what you just said?

[Polaris]

Actually, strictly speaking without adding any meaning to the word beyond what it actually means, atheists have killed and continue to kill the most people depending on the year (sometimes religious conflict* is responsible for more deaths in a certain year, sometimes secular strife in another year).

*The US and foreign intervention is responsible for the majority of the high-casualty religious wars though. Sure the Middle East was already a powder-keg full with pent-up tension and frustration, but the US is partially responsible (the USSR was the other instigator) for igniting the fuse.

Can I get some figures to back up what you just said?

Well in particular...2009 for sure when you had the end of the Sri Lankan Civil War (20,000 civilians alone killed) and the Mexican Drug War among regional conflicts in Africa. There were a couple other years in that period such as 2005, but I did not pay attention to Africa much during that period.

Now on atheists, the wars in the 20th century and the logical assertion that many who end up even in the religious wars weren't believers but forced to fight anyway. It's an assertion that atheists now use, that many in the past were forced for admit they believed for fear of being shunned by their peers or torture/death for not admitting they believed in the religion.

This is not to say at all that those who are religious did not kill because they killed in plenty, but that political and ethnic conflicts promoting more secular ideals were responsible for more deaths...though you can easily say that the 20th century was unique in the excessive amount of heavy weapons that were introduced that caused unimaginable death, destruction, and mayhem.

[Hovik]

Atheists killed the most! No, Christians killed the most! What about them Muslims! And those fucking pagans! Oh, look; we're almost at the centre of the Earth - keep digging!

Actually, strictly speaking without adding any meaning to the word beyond what it actually means, atheists have killed and continue to kill the most people depending on the year (sometimes religious conflict* is responsible for more deaths in a certain year, sometimes secular strife in another year).

*The US and foreign intervention is responsible for the majority of the high-casualty religious wars though. Sure the Middle East was already a powder-keg full with pent-up tension and frustration, but the US is partially responsible (the USSR was the other instigator) for igniting the fuse.

Let's make a careful distinction here. Religion is an ideology. People get killed (and kill) in the name of such ideologies.

Atheism is not an ideology; it's a stance on the existence of God or gods. One cannot kill in the name of atheism. If by some fucking happenstance the case is such that the most killers in the world have been atheists, that detail is irrelevant to and beside the point. People are motivated to kill by ideologies. If there are atheists who were motivated to kill by other ideologies, that has no connection to atheism. Atheism is simply a stance on the existence of gods, nothing more.

In short, religion has the capacity to motivate; atheism has no such capacity.

[Annik]

Can I get some figures to back up what you just said?

Well in particular...2009 for sure when you had the end of the Sri Lankan Civil War (20,000 civilians alone killed) and the Mexican Drug War among regional conflicts in Africa. There were a couple other years in that period such as 2005, but I did not pay attention to Africa much during that period.

Now on atheists, the wars in the 20th century and the logical assertion that many who end up even in the religious wars weren't believers but forced to fight anyway. It's an assertion that atheists now use, that many in the past were forced for admit they believed for fear of being shunned by their peers or torture/death for not admitting they believed in the religion.

This is not to say at all that those who are religious did not kill because they killed in plenty, but that political and ethnic conflicts promoting more secular ideals were responsible for more deaths...though you can easily say that the 20th century was unique in the excessive amount of heavy weapons that were introduced that caused unimaginable death, destruction, and mayhem.

Okay, so you have no figures. Gotcha.