(May 31, 2013 at 2:46 pm)meak Wrote: I don't align myself with either side of the debate but I can say that the more kindly you talk to people, the more they'll listen.

That depends on the person. I don't think that there is one approach that is effective with everyone. If you are gentle it may simply prompt the other person to assume that you're a pushover, and they'll respond aggressively. If they have a worthwhile point to make, they can make it regardless of how they are approached.

Since you're unlikely to find common ground with everyone even if you mix up your approaches, your best bet is to be yourself. That way you'll be more comfortable with the people who decide to engage with you, and you can dismiss those who won't. It's a discussion forum; not being friends with everyone is only a problem if you want it to be.

Getting your panties in a twist over how you're treated by strangers on the internet is also only a problem if you want it to be.

"Boo hoo, someone said the F word around me!"

Change your Pampers and find your pacifier. Jesus.

(May 31, 2013 at 2:57 pm)Faith No More Wrote:

(May 31, 2013 at 2:46 pm)meak Wrote: Isn't that the point? To make people understand your truth?

It was at first, I guess. I have come to the conclusion, however, that most of the people with misconceptions of atheism aren't actually interested in learning what it truly entails. People seem more content to revel in their own perceptions than to actually listen to the other side and truly understand. I figure now that direct debate is futile, and only demonstrating you're not the evil baby-eater they think you are will make any difference. If they refuse to see the truth simply because I use the f-word, is that really my problem?

I don't have a problem with the F-word as long as it's not a personal attack. The only argument I'll stop listening to is if the other person starts insulting me personally over what I believe. I think people can be respectful to eachother and say the f-word all they want. It's just a word. People who get all uppity about language are looking for an easy excuse to stop listening and that's irritating.

(May 31, 2013 at 4:49 pm)meak Wrote: I don't have a problem with the F-word as long as it's not a personal attack.

Me, too. I don't even have a problem if someone says that word to me as a personal attack because that is just their own problem and it doesn't necessarily prove anything about myself. If that happens in a forum, however, and if the person says it consistently/repeatedly along with other insults, then it's quite probable that he's going to be put on a shorter leash by one of us (just for the sake of moderating the forum, I suppose), but that doesn't mean that his words actually affected me in any way.

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(May 31, 2013 at 6:08 am)little_monkey Wrote: Of course if you enjoy the insults and the swearing, that's another matter - perhaps there should be threads just to perform that kind of stuff so you can relieve yourself,

We already have some threads exactly for that purpose.

The Silly Insult Thread
You're all *****

It's all too common as well for language nannies not to give a damn about offending other people, and get all self-righteous and entitled when you point out their behavior.

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(June 1, 2013 at 6:49 pm)Rayaan Wrote: If that happens in a forum, however, and if the person says it consistently/repeatedly along with other insults, then it's quite probable that he's going to be put on a shorter leash by one of us (just for the sake of moderating the forum, I suppose), but that doesn't mean that his words actually affected me in any way.

What does being "put on a shorter leash" entail? I was on a forum, ironically called "Buddhism Without Boundaries," in which I posted a reply to a post from the perspective of Rawls' theory of justice. The moderators deleted it because it wasn't an answer from "a Buddhist perspective," but because nobody informed me that it had been deleted or why, I reposted it, thinking some browser glitch or something had swallowed it (their software had basically non-existent personal messaging). I was then put on special status where all of my posts had to be approved by a moderator before being added to a thread. (After a few weeks of good behavior and no change, I stopped visiting.) Buddhists are such assholes. Despite all their fluffy talk about compassion and tolerance, they are some of the most arrogant and intolerant people I know. I've come to appreciate the flipside of "the squeaky wheel gets the grease" being that people who go on ad nauseum about virtues are often the people most lacking in them; it makes perfect sense that people with ego problems would be attracted to a religion that preaches that egos are a problem and what to do about it.

Anyway, that's what "shorter leash" meant there (a vBulletin forum), and I know that we once had the Gauntlet. What does being put on a shorter leash at AF mean?

(June 1, 2013 at 7:41 pm)apophenia Wrote:


What does being put on a shorter leash at AF mean?

It probably means something slightly different to each staff member.

From my perspective, it means "we're gonna give you just enough rope to hang yourself". Or, more succinctly: "You just got your last warning". Fortunately, it rarely gets to that point.

We don't really use post moderation (it's a pain in everyone's ass).

(June 1, 2013 at 7:41 pm)apophenia Wrote: What does being put on a shorter leash at AF mean?

"Shorter leash" at AF = handing a warning whether verbal or official, or sometimes it can mean just "keeping an eye on them." That was just a visual way of putting it, nothing else.

We used to put people on post moderation, but we don't do that anymore.

(June 1, 2013 at 6:49 pm)Rayaan Wrote:

(May 31, 2013 at 4:49 pm)meak Wrote: I don't have a problem with the F-word as long as it's not a personal attack.

Me, too. I don't even have a problem if someone says that word to me as a personal attack because that is just their own problem and it doesn't necessarily prove anything about myself. If that happens in a forum, however, and if the person says it consistently/repeatedly along with other insults, then it's quite probable that he's going to be put on a shorter leash by one of us (just for the sake of moderating the forum, I suppose), but that doesn't mean that his words actually affected me in any way.

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(May 31, 2013 at 6:08 am)little_monkey Wrote: Of course if you enjoy the insults and the swearing, that's another matter - perhaps there should be threads just to perform that kind of stuff so you can relieve yourself,

We already have some threads exactly for that purpose.

The Silly Insult Thread
You're all *****

Just look what happened to the F-word: it's fucking horrible; it's fucking beautiful; last night, I fucking freaking out; get the fuck out of here; go fuck yourself; blah, blah, blah...

It's been abused, overused to the point it can mean anything you want. There was a time, yep I'm that old, when the word was rarely used, and when it was used, people paid attention. Today, it's just background noise. Or it just means that the user lacks imagination in transmitting a better message.

Personal opinion. I still think its a great word and people obviously still pay attention or it wouldn't bother them so much.

It depends. In my, case I see it as background noise, or lack imagination. To many other people, they see the user as being crude, and often in those cases, whatever message was intended to be transmitted is lost. Put it in the column of Bad Strategy.