(May 31, 2013 at 9:16 am)thesummerqueen Wrote: I didn't say most kids are atheists. It's a rising number, is all, and the tide will eventually turn.

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I didn't claim victory either. I just said I wasn't going to toe the line to their feelings solely because they're frightened by a few words. They don't like "shit" in place of "worthless" because they ascribe magical meaning to a word.

If I wanted magic and words, I'd go play with the Kabbalah. Meanwhile, as I already said, I'll call a spade a spade.

The theist have divine(blind) faith on their side, we have rational reason supported by empirical evidence on ours. If we can't win the war, it won't be due that ours doesn't have the better argument but that we are no good at fighting the war. If Dawkins is having a hard time, it's basically due to his choice of words. Telling a christian that Jesus is gay or a fraud or his religion is a piece of shit, whatever you want, won't win you any points.

Neither will reasoning politely with them. People do that too all the time.

Education, not debate, will win the day. That's the way to fight. I don't expect to change any minds here with discussion. I do hope that sometimes I point people to the right links or explain something in a more understandable way for them to see a little more clearly, as I can only hope they'll do for me. But that still doesn't mean one has to stop cursing for that to happen.

(April 25, 2013 at 1:50 pm)lordxenu Wrote: Atheists are supposed to be the elite of the educated masses. We are supposed to spread knowledge, not ridicule.

What idiot told you that?

Atheists are required to do one thing and one thing only: not believe in gods. That's it. That's all. Nothing else.

(May 31, 2013 at 10:38 am)the antithesis Wrote:

(April 25, 2013 at 1:50 pm)lordxenu Wrote: Atheists are supposed to be the elite of the educated masses. We are supposed to spread knowledge, not ridicule.

What idiot told you that?

Atheists are required to do one thing and one thing only: not believe in gods. That's it. That's all. Nothing else.

It does happen quite often that they end up being quite educated in order to put their minds at ease on some questions which the theists simply answer with a goddidit.
However, "often" is not the same as "always"...

(May 31, 2013 at 10:26 am)thesummerqueen Wrote: Neither will reasoning politely with them. People do that too all the time.

Not that I want to brag in bringing these numbers, but I have thousands of posts on AF.com, now seem defunct, and thousands on other forums, including several on theist forums, and my experience is quite the opposite of your claim.

Quote:Education, not debate, will win the day. That's the way to fight. I don't expect to change any minds here with discussion. I do hope that sometimes I point people to the right links or explain something in a more understandable way for them to see a little more clearly, as I can only hope they'll do for me. But that still doesn't mean one has to stop cursing for that to happen.

Agree on the education issue, but that war is going to be won in the political arena. Not here, on this forum. And the reality is that cursing in that arena will get you nowhere. Problem is, if you curse here you will do it everywhere. Few people can exercise restrain once the beast has been unleashed.

(May 31, 2013 at 11:26 am)little_monkey Wrote: Agree on the education issue, but that war is going to be won in the political arena. Not here, on this forum.

Then what does it matter if we or Dawkins use swear language?

I don't align myself with either side of the debate but I can say that the more kindly you talk to people, the more they'll listen. Isn't that the point? To make people understand your truth?

(May 31, 2013 at 2:46 pm)meak Wrote: I don't align myself with either side of the debate but I can say that the more kindly you talk to people, the more they'll listen. Isn't that the point? To make people understand your truth?

Mmmm... it's more 'to present a strong case which has capacity to be understood by another.' You can't make people understand... that's on them

(May 31, 2013 at 2:46 pm)meak Wrote: Isn't that the point? To make people understand your truth?

It was at first, I guess. I have come to the conclusion, however, that most of the people with misconceptions of atheism aren't actually interested in learning what it truly entails. People seem more content to revel in their own perceptions than to actually listen to the other side and truly understand. I figure now that direct debate is futile, and only demonstrating you're not the evil baby-eater they think you are will make any difference. If they refuse to see the truth simply because I use the f-word, is that really my problem?

Keep in mind, this all started with how people were being treated here, and I'd like to point out again that even if we smatter some of our posts with swear language, we don't "abuse" people who treat us with equal respect - like good human beings. For some reason, people are conflating the reaction the douchebags get with EVERY theist that comes onto this board and that's simply not true.

AND we pick the shit out of any atheist that comes on here acting like a douchecopter as well.

Funny how people's memories work.