(March 2, 2011 at 10:24 am)The Diplomat Wrote: Ok, you're right, I should explain more about what i believe religious discussions should consist of.
Basically, everyone should be able to have a religious discussion without making personal attacks and/or getting angry at everyone.
Let's try.
Quote:Atheists: if there's no god, why should you feel such a strong need to convince others that there isn't one?
1. Because religious belief is normative, it effects ones behaviour and the way they vote, those two things effect everyone.
- Changing education standards and teaching children bullshit (creationism).
- Tax free status for mega millionaire pastors (I have nothing against small community churches being tax free).
- Impacts on personal freedoms like a gay persons right to marry and freedom from religion.
- Negligence, especially medical: For instance your own church's stance on Condoms, telling people that they cause AIDS is completely negligent and costs a great many lives.
- Lack of accountability: Church organisations tend to get away with actions that no other organisations would, for instance moving paedophiles around the world to avoid prosecution. Imagine if Merill Lynch moved paedophile executives to different branches because they didn't want to be prosecuted and face the bad publicity...
2. Because we are about true beliefs and would like others to have them too.
3. Because some of us enjoy debates.
Etc.
Quote:Let them have their naive beliefs, right? Theists: it's not your job to convert anybody, and nobody is making personal attacks (usually). No need to get angry.
Not their job... Depends who you ask, many people think that is exactly their job, to win converts for Christ.
Quote:I'm not saying there shouldn't be any religious debate, that's why I'm here; but it can be done without anybody believing that others' beliefs are loads of insufferable bill crap, because we all have gone through the stages of believing in the other "side".
Depends if their beliefs are insufferable crap or not.
Quote:Quoting my signature and claiming that that "says it all" is an example of replies I dislike. And bear in mind that when I say dislike, I mean replies that aren't good for the convo. For a good religious discussion to start, everyone has to kick back, grab a coke or whatever, and realize that the goal is to strengthen one's own beliefs, not convince others that they are correct.
That is a fundamental problem you have there... "Strengthening one's own beliefs"...
That is NOT the goal, the goal is to get towards the truth, after all that is what we value here. If you are only here to parade your own views then there is an [x] button in the top right (left for mac) corner, you might want to use it - On the other hand if you are here because you value logic and reason and believe you have good reasons for your beliefs then please share them and you'll get along just fine.
Quote:Some make it their goal to convince others that their beliefs are the right ones. That's the response I predict I will get... May I ask why? I'm honestly wondering, I know it sounds like I'm making a point, but I really just want to hear your side.
Well yeah, I think my beliefs are the right ones, if I thought they were wrong I necessarily wouldn't believe them...
It's not my goal to convince you I'm right, it's my goal to argue my position until someone proves it is wrong or finds error in my logic, at that point I seek a new position - Are you open to do the same?
Quote:Sorry I didn't see your post there
I believe in God because of a lot of things, the one that atheists would care about the most being that I believe it's the most logical explanation for the universe.
Care to present this logic?
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