(April 2, 2016 at 6:38 pm)athrock Wrote:(April 2, 2016 at 6:08 pm)Mr.wizard Wrote: No we are not saying the same thing! If pharaoh's heart couldn't harden without gods permission that means his free will was already violated. Either god hardened his heart violating his free will or his heart couldn't be hardened until god permitted it which was also violating his free will.
Pharaoh's heart could be hardened on his own accord. He did not need God's permission.
Let me this in negative terms. God did not prevent Pharaoh from hardening his own heart. To do so would have violated Pharaoh's free will. God allowed Pharaoh to choose. As the events unfolded, it became obvious that Pharaoh had chosen to harden his own heart. God allowed him to do this.
Why does god need to allow anything or give permission if you have free will? If god has to allow or permit it to happen then its not free will. Free will would mean pharaoh could harden his heart whether or not god permitted it.