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A Loving God
RE: A Loving God
(September 30, 2016 at 2:20 am)robvalue Wrote: Exactly. Any being which creates a system of punishment from which there is no escape is evil. It doesn't get much clearer than that.

It also shows how lacking in confidence it is in its ability to convince people. I mean, I used to be a maths teacher and I could get people to believe things without carrying around a torture rack. I had confidence in myself. And I wouldn't want them to just say they believed it so I didn't torture them, either.

What kind of sick fuck is this guy? Apart from fear, why is anyone giving him the time of day?

There is no "eternal punishment". Bad translation. The Greek words "kolasin aionion" means corrective chastisement for an age. The root meaning in kolasin is corrective pruning like for a tree. Not vindictive torment.
"Leave it to me to find a way to be,
Consider me a satellite forever orbiting,
I knew the rules but the rules did not know me, guaranteed." - Eddie Vedder
Reply



Messages In This Thread
A Loving God - by Lek - September 24, 2016 at 3:38 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 24, 2016 at 3:41 pm
RE: A Loving God - by LastPoet - September 24, 2016 at 3:54 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Alex K - September 24, 2016 at 4:01 pm
RE: A Loving God - by LostLocke - September 24, 2016 at 4:12 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Faith No More - September 24, 2016 at 4:14 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Angrboda - September 24, 2016 at 4:19 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 24, 2016 at 4:49 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Edwardo Piet - September 24, 2016 at 4:21 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 24, 2016 at 6:31 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Pat Mustard - September 26, 2016 at 5:33 am
RE: A Loving God - by LastPoet - September 24, 2016 at 5:03 pm
RE: A Loving God - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - September 24, 2016 at 6:47 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 24, 2016 at 6:57 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 24, 2016 at 7:03 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 24, 2016 at 7:20 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 24, 2016 at 7:45 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 24, 2016 at 7:54 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 24, 2016 at 7:55 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 24, 2016 at 8:22 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 24, 2016 at 8:32 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 24, 2016 at 8:48 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 24, 2016 at 8:49 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 24, 2016 at 8:59 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 24, 2016 at 9:06 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 24, 2016 at 9:13 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 24, 2016 at 10:19 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 25, 2016 at 12:27 am
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 30, 2016 at 4:30 am
RE: A Loving God - by Pat Mustard - September 26, 2016 at 5:36 am
RE: A Loving God - by Faith No More - September 24, 2016 at 8:32 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 24, 2016 at 8:49 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Primordial Bisque - September 24, 2016 at 9:17 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 24, 2016 at 9:33 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 24, 2016 at 10:15 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 24, 2016 at 10:22 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 24, 2016 at 10:27 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 24, 2016 at 10:36 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 24, 2016 at 10:22 pm
RE: A Loving God - by PETE_ROSE - September 24, 2016 at 10:50 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 24, 2016 at 11:05 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 24, 2016 at 11:19 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 25, 2016 at 5:58 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 25, 2016 at 6:13 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 25, 2016 at 9:20 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Homeless Nutter - September 25, 2016 at 9:37 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Primordial Bisque - September 25, 2016 at 9:49 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 25, 2016 at 9:53 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 25, 2016 at 10:15 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 25, 2016 at 10:19 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 25, 2016 at 10:24 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Homeless Nutter - September 25, 2016 at 10:27 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 26, 2016 at 8:01 am
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 26, 2016 at 12:59 pm
RE: A Loving God - by downbeatplumb - September 26, 2016 at 1:06 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Cato - September 26, 2016 at 6:11 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 26, 2016 at 6:40 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 26, 2016 at 9:52 pm
RE: A Loving God - by mcolafson - September 27, 2016 at 4:56 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Edwardo Piet - September 26, 2016 at 3:24 am
RE: A Loving God - by mcolafson - September 26, 2016 at 4:58 am
RE: A Loving God - by Pat Mustard - September 26, 2016 at 5:52 am
RE: A Loving God - by mcolafson - September 26, 2016 at 7:42 am
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - September 25, 2016 at 10:25 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 25, 2016 at 10:30 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Ravenshire - September 30, 2016 at 11:48 am
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 25, 2016 at 5:38 pm
RE: A Loving God - by PETE_ROSE - September 24, 2016 at 11:51 pm
RE: A Loving God - by PETE_ROSE - September 25, 2016 at 12:06 am
RE: A Loving God - by Faith No More - September 25, 2016 at 8:10 am
RE: A Loving God - by Silver - September 25, 2016 at 12:24 am
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 25, 2016 at 4:13 pm
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 25, 2016 at 12:58 am
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 25, 2016 at 1:00 am
RE: A Loving God - by Silver - September 25, 2016 at 1:01 am
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 25, 2016 at 1:01 am
RE: A Loving God - by Silver - September 25, 2016 at 1:03 am
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 25, 2016 at 1:08 am
RE: A Loving God - by Silver - September 25, 2016 at 1:10 am
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 25, 2016 at 1:18 am
RE: A Loving God - by Silver - September 25, 2016 at 1:21 am
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 25, 2016 at 1:27 am
RE: A Loving God - by Silver - September 25, 2016 at 1:29 am
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 25, 2016 at 1:40 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 25, 2016 at 1:45 am
RE: A Loving God - by Whateverist - September 25, 2016 at 1:54 am
RE: A Loving God - by Jackalope - September 25, 2016 at 6:23 pm
RE: A Loving God - by KevinM1 - September 25, 2016 at 9:37 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - September 25, 2016 at 10:32 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 25, 2016 at 10:35 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - September 25, 2016 at 11:18 pm
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 26, 2016 at 1:15 am
RE: A Loving God - by Silver - September 26, 2016 at 1:45 am
RE: A Loving God - by dyresand - September 26, 2016 at 2:10 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 26, 2016 at 3:18 am
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - September 26, 2016 at 9:36 am
RE: A Loving God - by mcolafson - September 26, 2016 at 5:09 am
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 26, 2016 at 5:19 am
RE: A Loving God - by downbeatplumb - September 26, 2016 at 10:12 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 26, 2016 at 5:21 am
RE: A Loving God - by Pat Mustard - September 26, 2016 at 5:22 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 26, 2016 at 6:36 am
RE: A Loving God - by Angrboda - September 26, 2016 at 6:56 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 26, 2016 at 8:22 am
RE: A Loving God - by mcolafson - September 26, 2016 at 8:34 am
RE: A Loving God - by Pat Mustard - September 26, 2016 at 10:25 am
RE: A Loving God - by Primordial Bisque - September 26, 2016 at 9:42 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 26, 2016 at 8:24 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 26, 2016 at 8:37 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 26, 2016 at 9:40 am
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - September 26, 2016 at 9:42 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 26, 2016 at 9:45 am
RE: A Loving God - by Drich - September 26, 2016 at 12:28 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 26, 2016 at 5:43 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 5:52 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 27, 2016 at 6:53 am
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 27, 2016 at 11:38 am
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 12:03 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 27, 2016 at 3:27 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 3:30 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 27, 2016 at 3:49 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 3:51 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 27, 2016 at 4:49 pm
RE: A Loving God - by mcolafson - September 27, 2016 at 4:52 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 27, 2016 at 4:59 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 27, 2016 at 5:34 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 5:48 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 27, 2016 at 6:13 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 6:49 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 27, 2016 at 7:14 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 9:32 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 27, 2016 at 9:40 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 9:45 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 27, 2016 at 9:52 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 9:59 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 27, 2016 at 10:11 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 10:19 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 10:20 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 27, 2016 at 10:26 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 10:39 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 27, 2016 at 10:54 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - September 28, 2016 at 9:54 am
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - September 28, 2016 at 9:49 am
RE: A Loving God - by Homeless Nutter - September 27, 2016 at 9:52 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 27, 2016 at 6:20 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 6:52 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 27, 2016 at 7:04 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 7:09 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 27, 2016 at 5:57 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Primordial Bisque - September 27, 2016 at 12:51 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Grandizer - September 27, 2016 at 1:02 pm
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 27, 2016 at 12:09 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Angrboda - September 27, 2016 at 2:12 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 11:06 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 27, 2016 at 11:11 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 11:23 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 27, 2016 at 11:39 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 11:46 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 27, 2016 at 11:51 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 27, 2016 at 11:54 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 28, 2016 at 12:01 am
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 28, 2016 at 5:24 am
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 29, 2016 at 2:08 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 29, 2016 at 7:27 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Ravenshire - September 30, 2016 at 7:32 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 8:34 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Pat Mustard - September 28, 2016 at 8:14 am
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 28, 2016 at 8:53 am
RE: A Loving God - by Pat Mustard - September 28, 2016 at 3:46 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 29, 2016 at 2:31 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 29, 2016 at 2:16 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Pat Mustard - October 1, 2016 at 6:26 am
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 1, 2016 at 2:49 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Pat Mustard - October 2, 2016 at 3:52 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 2, 2016 at 3:57 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 28, 2016 at 7:13 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 28, 2016 at 3:19 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 28, 2016 at 5:58 am
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 28, 2016 at 12:29 pm
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 28, 2016 at 1:04 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Primordial Bisque - September 28, 2016 at 3:01 pm
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 28, 2016 at 11:17 am
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - September 28, 2016 at 12:35 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 28, 2016 at 12:46 pm
RE: A Loving God - by KevinM1 - September 28, 2016 at 3:12 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - September 28, 2016 at 12:58 pm
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 28, 2016 at 1:22 pm
RE: A Loving God - by purplepurpose - September 28, 2016 at 1:47 pm
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 28, 2016 at 2:51 pm
RE: A Loving God - by KevinM1 - September 28, 2016 at 3:22 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 28, 2016 at 3:29 pm
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 29, 2016 at 3:57 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 29, 2016 at 4:35 am
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 29, 2016 at 4:46 am
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 29, 2016 at 12:46 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Pat Mustard - October 1, 2016 at 6:50 am
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - October 1, 2016 at 3:57 pm
RE: A Loving God - by downbeatplumb - September 29, 2016 at 1:42 pm
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 29, 2016 at 5:55 am
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 29, 2016 at 6:00 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 29, 2016 at 7:46 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 29, 2016 at 12:55 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 29, 2016 at 4:08 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Primordial Bisque - September 29, 2016 at 7:18 pm
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 29, 2016 at 1:51 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 29, 2016 at 3:14 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Ravenshire - September 30, 2016 at 7:35 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Primordial Bisque - September 29, 2016 at 3:45 pm
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 30, 2016 at 2:12 am
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 30, 2016 at 12:55 pm
RE: A Loving God - by ED scissor hands - September 30, 2016 at 2:17 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 30, 2016 at 8:20 am
RE: A Loving God - by ED scissor hands - September 30, 2016 at 5:03 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 30, 2016 at 12:45 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 30, 2016 at 1:09 pm
RE: A Loving God - by ED scissor hands - October 2, 2016 at 9:48 pm
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 30, 2016 at 2:20 am
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - September 30, 2016 at 1:02 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 30, 2016 at 1:12 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Primordial Bisque - September 30, 2016 at 1:21 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 1:54 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Primordial Bisque - September 30, 2016 at 2:06 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 2:12 pm
RE: A Loving God - by LostLocke - September 30, 2016 at 2:22 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 2:41 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Primordial Bisque - September 30, 2016 at 2:42 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 2:50 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Primordial Bisque - September 30, 2016 at 3:41 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 3:47 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Primordial Bisque - September 30, 2016 at 5:57 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 8:30 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 2:57 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Ravenshire - September 30, 2016 at 7:42 pm
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 30, 2016 at 7:54 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 1, 2016 at 6:22 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - September 30, 2016 at 1:45 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 30, 2016 at 2:58 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 1:50 pm
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 30, 2016 at 4:34 am
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 30, 2016 at 4:48 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 30, 2016 at 4:54 am
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 30, 2016 at 5:00 am
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 30, 2016 at 5:02 am
RE: A Loving God - by chimp3 - September 30, 2016 at 5:12 am
RE: A Loving God - by purplepurpose - September 30, 2016 at 11:28 am
RE: A Loving God - by ED scissor hands - September 30, 2016 at 11:33 am
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 3:07 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 30, 2016 at 3:29 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - September 30, 2016 at 3:20 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 3:29 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - September 30, 2016 at 3:36 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 3:40 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - September 30, 2016 at 3:53 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 3:31 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 30, 2016 at 3:50 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 4:01 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - September 30, 2016 at 4:08 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 8:19 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - October 1, 2016 at 12:29 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 1, 2016 at 3:34 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 3:51 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - September 30, 2016 at 3:54 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 4:00 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Huggy Bear - September 30, 2016 at 5:27 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - September 30, 2016 at 8:20 pm
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - September 30, 2016 at 11:58 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 1, 2016 at 3:03 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - October 1, 2016 at 4:04 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 1, 2016 at 4:50 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - October 1, 2016 at 5:50 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 1, 2016 at 5:57 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 1, 2016 at 5:00 pm
RE: A Loving God - by The Grand Nudger - October 1, 2016 at 5:12 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Lek - October 1, 2016 at 5:46 pm
RE: A Loving God - by The Grand Nudger - October 1, 2016 at 5:55 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - October 1, 2016 at 6:01 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 1, 2016 at 6:25 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - October 1, 2016 at 6:55 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 1, 2016 at 7:06 pm
RE: A Loving God - by LadyForCamus - October 1, 2016 at 8:47 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 1, 2016 at 8:54 pm
RE: A Loving God - by robvalue - October 2, 2016 at 12:58 am
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 2, 2016 at 2:53 pm
RE: A Loving God - by The Grand Nudger - October 2, 2016 at 3:01 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 2, 2016 at 3:23 pm
RE: A Loving God - by The Grand Nudger - October 2, 2016 at 3:25 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 2, 2016 at 3:41 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - October 2, 2016 at 3:35 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 2, 2016 at 3:42 pm
RE: A Loving God - by The Grand Nudger - October 2, 2016 at 3:52 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 2, 2016 at 4:02 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Cyberman - October 2, 2016 at 4:07 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Primordial Bisque - October 2, 2016 at 10:15 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 2, 2016 at 10:26 pm
RE: A Loving God - by The Grand Nudger - October 2, 2016 at 11:14 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 2, 2016 at 11:25 pm
RE: A Loving God - by The Grand Nudger - October 2, 2016 at 11:31 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 2, 2016 at 11:44 pm
RE: A Loving God - by The Grand Nudger - October 2, 2016 at 11:49 pm
RE: A Loving God - by Arkilogue - October 3, 2016 at 12:31 am

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