Occams Hatchet and Is Materialism "Special"

[The Grand Nudger]

It's not?  So ideas are whatever it is you think...what does that tell us about their composition though?  How does that tell us that ideas are made of ideas?  What is a medium outside of a material framework?  

Eh? What's matter made up of?  That's a weird question.

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Fair enough.  It's all degrees of conviction.  I have 100% conviction of my own mind and ideas, and of objects as highly consistent experiences.

You would have to claim 100% conviction in the accuracy and contents, of that mind, to support the claims you've been making..however.  I don't doubt for a minute that you have experiences.  This isn't a discussion of whether or not ideas or experiences exist, though, so?

That's right.  Table is an idea.  The brown-ness is an idea.  The flatness is an idea.  None of the properties of a table are represented in physical reality.  That is in fact what I'm saying.  Don't believe me?  Let's zoom in on my table and see how brown or flat it is. . . Whoops!  It turns out those properties are not there, and my perception is of an idea of a table.

Like I said, either you think that the idea of a table is an idea about a thing, that the universe exists, or you don;t...but that's -not- a problem for materialism, at all.  It;s a problem you have with the availability and access to knowledge...except when you don,t when you declare 100% conviction in this that or the other.  When you tell us that stuff is made of ideas, that ideas are all we have, and that -some- of our (but not your) ideas are insufficient for this, that, or the other.

To a materialist, brown is a particular wavelength of light. They have a test that demonstrates that this is so. They think that their idea of a table is an idea about a thing, they have a test that demonstrates that this is so. But here we are, and here you are, talking like materialism is actually true, no one -made- you reference QM.....so....? You'll need to realize, at some point, that if you think qm is informative, if you point to it's truth as support for your position..you're accepting materialism, not objecting to it. QM is necessarily materialistic. If it weren't...it would just be more non-science, and we know how you feel about that.

I'm not asserting that a club is either material OR immaterial.  I'm saying that as we experience it, it represents experiences and ideas and not more than experiences and ideas.  And we know nothing more than our experience of it.

You know nothing more than your experience of your experience and yet you don't mind making claims and counter-claims about it's composition. Look, lol, I understand the objection...but you've moved beyond it in offering your own position and even -within your arguments against materialism, so either you allow others to do as you've done or you're just stonewalling. That's not -actually- an objection, just a refusal to engage in the discussion on equal grounds which you, yourself, chose to lay out.