(October 14, 2017 at 8:56 am)Little Rik Wrote: Most atheists say..........well if God is real why then He doesn't show to us?
Yes. Divine hiddenness is a real problem for theists.
Quote:Before to make my comment I show you how Jesus put this question.
19. Unaided by the Spirit-breath, the work of intellection tends to solve the problems of the things we see, and nothing more.
20. The senses were ordained to bring into the mind mere pictures of the things that pass away; they do not deal with real things; they do not comprehend eternal law.
21. But man has something in his soul, a something that will tear the veil apart that he may see the world of real things.
22. We call this something, spirit consciousness; it sleeps in every soul, and cannot be awakened till the Holy Breath becomes a welcome guest.
23. This Holy Breath knocks at the door of every soul, but cannot enter in until the will of man throws wide the door.
24. There is no power in intellect to turn the key; philosophy and science both have toiled to get a glimpse behind the veil; but they have failed.
25. The secret spring that throws ajar the door of soul is touched by nothing else than purity in life, by prayer and holy thought.
Hod do you know what Jesus said? He never wrote anything. All we have is texts, written decades or more after Jesus lived, written by anonymous non eyewitnesses, and we have no originals.
But of course for you, that is iron clad evidence.![]()
[quote]It say.........cannot enter in until the will of man throws wide the door.........
You see?
Is all about opening.
How someone who is not interested in this opening can perceive God.
Isn't it a catch 22 situation?
On one hand atheists would like to get evidence but at the same time they keep the door shut so how can God
enter?
I guess you guy never thought about it, did you?
No, it is not a catch 22.
Any god, who wants me to know he exists, and understands what constitutes evidence based thinking, reasoned argument, and valid/sound logic, would also understand my reasons for not being convinced he exists. He would also know how to convince me, yet he constantly fails to do so.
So, I am left with the following conclusions:
1. He doesn't care if I believe he exists.
2. He does not manifest in reality, therefore leaves no evidence of his existence. And is therefore indistinguishable from a god that does not exist.
3. Or he doesn't exist.
If he exists, yet refuses to demonstrate his existence to me, and is going to punish me for not believing he exists, then I want nothing to do with a god like that. That is an immoral god.
You'd believe if you just opened your heart" is a terrible argument for religion. It's basically saying, "If you bias yourself enough, you can convince yourself that this is true." If religion were true, people wouldn't need faith to believe it -- it would be supported by good evidence.