My view and reasons for them. Atheist and Christians welcome here. (short)

[Simon Moon]

Bold mine.

But others do have a method to see of our beliefs accurately map to reality. And that is by basing them on demonstrable and falsifiable evidence, reasoned argument and valid and sound logic.

You really don't believe that there is a reliable method to determine fact from fiction? Or what is likely true, from what is unlikely true? Then why do we lock up insane people? I am sure there are many schizophrenics you can get many different subjective interpretations of reality from, that are demonstrable not true. And of course, you don't believe them.

The fact that you are unable to see the difference in the reliability of beliefs based on subjective interpretations, and based on demonstrable evidence and reasoned argument, says a lot about your credulity.

When I accept a claim to be true, I do so based on the above criteria (demonstrable and falsifiable evidence, reasoned argument and valid and sound logic). If the claim is not supported by those criteria, then I withhold belief.

The interesting thing is, I can guarantee that, when it comes to other aspects of your life, you don't base your beliefs on subjective interpretations. I'll bet when you cross the street, you make your decision based on evidence, not subjective interpretation. "It sure looks there is a car coming, but my subjective interpretation makes me believe the street is clear", said you never.

Why are your god beliefs immune to the same level of scrutiny as other aspects of your life? Why base them on subjective interpretations, yet use evidence and reason when choosing a surgeon, for example?

I think due to the lack of grasp on reality that we have as a species that this influences our effectiveness or lack there of in determining what is fact. I think we can know some things but that is limited to our perception/brain/tools. I think we have bias because of our limitations and that what we think we are measuring might be things that we want to happen anyways, again due to our bias because of our limitations.

Of course our knowledge of reality is limited, and imperfect. But that does not mean that we don't have some tools to evaluate claims.

The fact that we don't have a perfect grasp of reality, does not mean we should throw up are hands and just believe anything that makes us feel good, or seems to fit our subjective interpretations.

The scientific method seems to do a pretty damn good job of eliminating biases, presuppositions and preconceptions.

Human life expectancy has doubled in the last 100 years, we fly on planes, use cell phones, travel to other planets, etc, all based on evidence based science. Zero faith was involved.

I never said or claimed that my beliefs are not something that can't be put under scrutiny.

I said that. I was trying to show that you most likely use evidence in other aspects of your life, but you rely on subjective interpretation for your god beliefs. If you applied the least bit of critical scrutiny to your subjective god beliefs, you would see that you have not rational reason to accept them.

I've never been in surgery, but if you mean that I direct my actions based on what I know, they yes, ofc, but I can't always assume that what I know is accurate because my perception is not perfect. What you are arguing here is what I would call is based on a priori knowledge and not anything that I really need evidence for. Action is not the same as belief.

Beliefs inform actions.

If you did need surgery, would you go to a faith healer, or a highly (scientifically) trained professional?

The fact that our perceptions are not always accurate, does not mean there is no way to tell the best course of action, based on what evidence we do have.