RE: The Implications of Quran 30:2 and 30:3
July 2, 2018 at 6:40 pm
(This post was last modified: July 2, 2018 at 7:27 pm by ReptilianPeon.)
Hi,
Either they were Byzantines or they weren't. There is no opinion.
The Eastern Roman empire IS the Byzantines. Pretty much everyone agrees - well historians that is - that it is the continuation of the Roman empire. The people living in the Eastern Roman empire identified themselves as Romans (not as Byzantines, because not all of them lived in the city of Byzantium). The term Byzantine comes from the name of the city of "Byzantium" which was the capital of the Eastern Roman empire.
The Roman empire was divided into two for administrative purposes. Somebody asked why the empire was split on Quora and there are some good explanations in reply. The Eastern Romans later took control of Rome after it fell.
The last Western Roman emperor was Romulus Augustulus, who reigned for less than a year, having been deposed in 476 (centuries before Muhammad). The video I have linked to by CrashCourse explains things better than I can. I hope it is useful.
The time-frame wasn't mentioned by the Quran, okay, maybe not? However, we do know when the Romans were at war with the Sassanians and when Syria fell (as I mentioned, Jerusalem was captured by the Sassanians in 614AD so it had to have been before then). This limits us to the twenty-six years that the Romans were at war with the Sassanians; that's the time-fame.
But here's the thing...
Surah 30 (ar-Rum) is a Meccan Surah sure; meaning pre-Hijrah. However, there is Ijma for it being a "late Meccan" revelation. Meaning: it was said to have been revealed years AFTER the Romans lost Syria to the Sassanians.
See here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_su..._the_Quran
Jerusalem captured by the Sassansians in 614AD, Syria fell to the Sassaisians in 609AD. Therefore, Ar Rum was revealed after the Romans lost. Or am I missing something?
See the next verse, as pointed out by yragnitup:
The very next Iyaht says that they are still (or will be) in Mecca when the news reaches them. So how can they be "nearby" to the Romans as 30:3-4 claim. Is Syria anywhere near to Mecca?
Just wanted to say I wrote the above at like midnight so I want applgise in advance if there are any typos or mistakes etc.
Quote:So the "Byzantines" are a mere opinion.
Either they were Byzantines or they weren't. There is no opinion.
The Eastern Roman empire IS the Byzantines. Pretty much everyone agrees - well historians that is - that it is the continuation of the Roman empire. The people living in the Eastern Roman empire identified themselves as Romans (not as Byzantines, because not all of them lived in the city of Byzantium). The term Byzantine comes from the name of the city of "Byzantium" which was the capital of the Eastern Roman empire.
The Roman empire was divided into two for administrative purposes. Somebody asked why the empire was split on Quora and there are some good explanations in reply. The Eastern Romans later took control of Rome after it fell.
The last Western Roman emperor was Romulus Augustulus, who reigned for less than a year, having been deposed in 476 (centuries before Muhammad). The video I have linked to by CrashCourse explains things better than I can. I hope it is useful.
The time-frame wasn't mentioned by the Quran, okay, maybe not? However, we do know when the Romans were at war with the Sassanians and when Syria fell (as I mentioned, Jerusalem was captured by the Sassanians in 614AD so it had to have been before then). This limits us to the twenty-six years that the Romans were at war with the Sassanians; that's the time-fame.
But here's the thing...
Surah 30 (ar-Rum) is a Meccan Surah sure; meaning pre-Hijrah. However, there is Ijma for it being a "late Meccan" revelation. Meaning: it was said to have been revealed years AFTER the Romans lost Syria to the Sassanians.
See here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_su..._the_Quran
Quote:Surah 30:
Late Mecca phase (620 - 622 AD).
Except 17, from Medina
Jerusalem captured by the Sassansians in 614AD, Syria fell to the Sassaisians in 609AD. Therefore, Ar Rum was revealed after the Romans lost. Or am I missing something?
See the next verse, as pointed out by yragnitup:
(June 28, 2018 at 10:58 pm)yragnitup Wrote: Just to add, see the next verse too;
Within three to nine years. To Allah belongs the command before and after. And that day the believers will rejoice (Quran 30:4)
Why would the supposed Muslims in Mecca rejoice? Maybe its the Arab Nabataens in Petra?
A guy named Hamed Abdel-Samad has some extensive videos (100s) which includes this topic but its mostly in Arabic. Only some episodes in the beginning (44) ~10 minute videos was translated by a fan and I think there was mention of Petra etc. I watched them long time ago. Maybe you can pick up some leads.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCOYN5F3...iCI_JaaktA
The very next Iyaht says that they are still (or will be) in Mecca when the news reaches them. So how can they be "nearby" to the Romans as 30:3-4 claim. Is Syria anywhere near to Mecca?
Just wanted to say I wrote the above at like midnight so I want applgise in advance if there are any typos or mistakes etc.
