(October 17, 2018 at 10:34 am)OakTree500 Wrote:(October 17, 2018 at 10:06 am)SteveII Wrote: 1) Saying that miracles are not an accepted fact is question begging. What kind of miracle-seeking experiment would make any logical sense? The very definition of a miracle has in it the a) inability to predict and b) the all-important feature that you can only see the effect--never the cause--something that throws a monkey wrench in experiments. I never said I would not look for counter-evidence=straw man.
You can't win this debate. You would have to prove my worldview wrong.
Well, no. You're the one claiming it's true, so you have to prove that it's correct. As always, that's the burden of proof.
The problem is with "Miracles", in the billions [or thousands if that's your belief] of years that the earth has been in existence, and all these supposed miracles that have happened, why has it never happened to a scientist?
You suppose god knows that atheists are questioning it, why not perform a miracle and turn all our science books into bibles in front of our very eyes? Better yet, why not just physically appear in the sky right now, and tell us it's real?
You say "oh well you can't predict a miracle etc etc" well that's bull shit I say. You're only "proof" they EVER happened is in the NT and OT. Without that, you have nothing, other than the word of crazy people who say they've seen something that they haven't.
Steve, with said burden, you have to prove yourself right.
And you are the one claiming that it is not... which means that you share a burden of proof to show that is true. This appears to be nothing more than pseudo skepticism and your comment about scientist nothing more than scientism. You don't need a scientist to tell you what to believe. They study specific things, and share that information that they gather with you, the same as anything else. They don't see any better than any other random person.
It is said that an argument is what convinces reasonable men and a proof is what it takes to convince even an unreasonable man. - Alexander Vilenkin
If I am shown my error, I will be the first to throw my books into the fire. - Martin Luther
If I am shown my error, I will be the first to throw my books into the fire. - Martin Luther