Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: May 25, 2024, 2:11 pm

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Is Moral Nihilism a Morality?
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality?
(July 2, 2019 at 11:25 pm)vulcanlogician Wrote:
(July 2, 2019 at 10:55 pm)DLJ Wrote: Sure, the dialectic, the scientific method... all good. But that’s not quite what I meant.

I’m attempting to build a model that accounts for / encompasses all perspectives (however dumb they might be) and the formation of those perspectives.

Okay. But aren't some perspectives just plain wrong? eg. flat earth, creationism etc.

What good model encompasses "just plain wrong" perspectives?
...

A generic one. One that accounts for flawed reasoning and faulty beliefs too.

(July 2, 2019 at 11:25 pm)vulcanlogician Wrote:
(July 2, 2019 at 10:55 pm)DLJ Wrote: ...
I mean tangible vs. intangible - for example, fiction, concepts, ideas etc. All part of reality-reality. But not as real in the same way as reality-reality.

"physical vs. logical" comes from network topology... the physical design of a network vs. information flows. In biology the analogy would be: genes and memes.

You lost me a little bit. It's the second line about network vs. information flows that I don't quite follow.
...

Sorry. Maybe I’m jumping ahead a bit.

I’m looking at humans as ‘phenotypic machines’ (service providers to internal and external stakeholders) thus as food-processors and information-processors... body-mind kinda thing.

(July 2, 2019 at 11:25 pm)vulcanlogician Wrote: The first line makes sense to me and, again, I'm reminded of Plato so I'm going to (annoyingly?) refer to his thinking to see if there is overlap between what you are saying and he is saying:

Quote:Far and away the most influential passage in Western philosophy ever written is Plato's discussion of the prisoners of the cave and his abstract presentation of the divided line. For Plato, human beings live in a world of visible and intelligible things. The visible world is what surrounds us: what we see, what we hear, what we experience; this visible world is a world of change and uncertainty. The intelligible world is made up of the unchanging products of human reason: anything arising from reason alone, such as abstract definitions or mathematics, makes up this intelligible world, which is the world of reality. The intelligible world contains the eternal "Forms" (in Greek, idea ) of things; the visible world is the imperfect and changing manifestation in this world of these unchanging forms. For example, the "Form" or "Idea" of a horse is intelligible, abstract, and applies to all horses; this Form never changes, even though horses vary wildly among themselves—the Form of a horse would never change even if every horse in the world were to vanish. An individual horse is a physical, changing object that can easily cease to be a horse (if, for instance, it's dropped out of a fifty story building); the Form of a horse, or "horseness," never changes. As a physical object, a horse only makes sense in that it can be referred to the "Form" or "Idea" of horseness.
http://physics.weber.edu/carroll/honors/Plato.htm

Is this what you're getting at?

No annoyance here. It’s exactly what I’d hoped for.

Plato’s ‘visible’ and ‘intelligible’ (as described above) fit nicely with Popper’s Worlds 1 and 3. But does not account for your ‘reality-reality’.

The latter would be closer to Kant’s Noumenon / thing in itself.

Please correct me if I’m wrong. My background is not philosophy (no one is surprised) it’s data/information governance and management.

(July 3, 2019 at 12:52 am)Belaqua Wrote:
(July 2, 2019 at 10:55 pm)DLJ Wrote: I mean tangible vs. intangible - for example, fiction, concepts, ideas etc. All part of reality-reality. But not as real in the same way as reality-reality.

I wonder if Popper's Three Worlds structure might be useful here.

https://tannerlectures.utah.edu/_documen...pper80.pdf

Yes. Thank you.

There’s some weak semantics there (which no doubt Popper covers in other publications) e.g. “mind”, “thought process”, “objective”, “consciousness”, “knowledge” and there seems to be a misstep in the summary when describing World 2 as “conscious experience” when earlier it was described as “process”.

But yes, that’s the kind of thing.

So, can we label Kant’s Noumenon and Vulcanology’s Reality-reality as World 0 given that World 1 (as described) requires human lenses and filters to detect/perceive/interpretat its contents?
The PURPOSE of life is to replicate our DNA ................. (from Darwin)
The MEANING of life is the experience of living ... (from Frank Herbert)
The VALUE of life is the legacy we leave behind ..... (from observation)
Reply



Messages In This Thread
Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - May 12, 2019 at 12:07 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by ignoramus - May 12, 2019 at 12:22 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - May 12, 2019 at 6:04 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by Alan V - May 12, 2019 at 6:56 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - May 12, 2019 at 8:18 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by Alan V - May 12, 2019 at 8:26 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by Alan V - May 12, 2019 at 7:57 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - May 12, 2019 at 11:08 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by Alan V - May 12, 2019 at 2:36 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - May 12, 2019 at 4:11 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by Angrboda - May 12, 2019 at 12:18 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by Belacqua - May 12, 2019 at 6:01 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - May 12, 2019 at 8:35 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by brewer - May 12, 2019 at 1:41 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by ignoramus - May 12, 2019 at 7:40 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by chimp3 - May 12, 2019 at 9:41 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - May 12, 2019 at 9:44 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by chimp3 - May 12, 2019 at 10:19 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - May 12, 2019 at 11:31 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - May 13, 2019 at 12:42 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by Alan V - May 13, 2019 at 12:50 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by Mister Agenda - May 13, 2019 at 9:21 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - May 13, 2019 at 10:06 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - May 13, 2019 at 12:52 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - May 13, 2019 at 2:15 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - May 15, 2019 at 4:11 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 10, 2019 at 2:28 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - May 21, 2019 at 5:02 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by mcc1789 - May 21, 2019 at 9:39 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - May 21, 2019 at 11:00 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 10, 2019 at 5:44 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 10, 2019 at 11:05 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 10, 2019 at 12:22 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 10, 2019 at 2:35 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 10, 2019 at 2:39 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 10, 2019 at 2:43 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 10, 2019 at 2:53 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 10, 2019 at 2:56 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 10, 2019 at 2:56 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 10, 2019 at 3:08 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 10, 2019 at 3:17 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 10, 2019 at 3:32 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 11, 2019 at 5:52 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 11, 2019 at 7:05 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 12, 2019 at 7:13 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 11, 2019 at 6:00 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 10, 2019 at 12:42 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 11, 2019 at 5:55 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 11, 2019 at 6:09 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 11, 2019 at 6:02 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 11, 2019 at 6:03 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 11, 2019 at 6:09 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 11, 2019 at 6:16 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 11, 2019 at 6:20 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 11, 2019 at 6:25 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 11, 2019 at 6:24 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 11, 2019 at 6:56 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 11, 2019 at 8:41 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 11, 2019 at 9:28 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 11, 2019 at 9:59 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 11, 2019 at 10:30 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 11, 2019 at 11:47 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 11, 2019 at 12:19 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 11, 2019 at 12:31 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 11, 2019 at 12:55 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 11, 2019 at 1:01 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 12, 2019 at 8:22 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 12, 2019 at 9:04 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 12, 2019 at 9:14 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 12, 2019 at 9:08 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 12, 2019 at 9:11 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 12, 2019 at 9:11 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 12, 2019 at 9:50 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 12, 2019 at 10:37 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 12, 2019 at 11:25 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 12, 2019 at 11:28 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 12, 2019 at 1:07 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 12, 2019 at 4:36 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 12, 2019 at 5:22 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 12, 2019 at 1:42 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 12, 2019 at 5:29 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 12, 2019 at 5:30 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 12, 2019 at 5:23 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 12, 2019 at 5:45 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 12, 2019 at 5:49 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 12, 2019 at 5:58 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 12, 2019 at 6:04 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 12, 2019 at 6:42 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 12, 2019 at 6:46 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 12, 2019 at 7:01 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 12, 2019 at 7:12 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 12, 2019 at 7:37 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 12, 2019 at 8:04 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 13, 2019 at 12:45 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 13, 2019 at 5:49 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 13, 2019 at 10:06 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 13, 2019 at 11:19 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 13, 2019 at 1:43 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 13, 2019 at 3:24 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 14, 2019 at 5:06 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 14, 2019 at 8:48 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 14, 2019 at 9:49 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 14, 2019 at 11:39 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 15, 2019 at 6:24 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 15, 2019 at 8:36 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by SenseMaker007 - June 16, 2019 at 4:26 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by DLJ - June 21, 2019 at 4:31 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 21, 2019 at 7:20 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by DLJ - June 21, 2019 at 9:41 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 26, 2019 at 8:55 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by DLJ - June 26, 2019 at 5:29 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - June 26, 2019 at 6:53 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by DLJ - June 26, 2019 at 8:03 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - July 1, 2019 at 11:21 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by DLJ - July 2, 2019 at 10:55 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - July 2, 2019 at 11:25 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by Belacqua - July 3, 2019 at 12:52 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 21, 2019 at 7:38 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by DLJ - June 21, 2019 at 11:09 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - June 26, 2019 at 10:07 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by DLJ - July 3, 2019 at 9:38 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - July 4, 2019 at 9:51 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by DLJ - July 10, 2019 at 2:49 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - July 12, 2019 at 2:06 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by Belacqua - July 13, 2019 at 5:58 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by DLJ - July 15, 2019 at 12:01 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by vulcanlogician - July 16, 2019 at 8:56 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by DLJ - July 17, 2019 at 11:50 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - July 12, 2019 at 8:19 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by DLJ - July 12, 2019 at 1:24 pm
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - July 14, 2019 at 9:16 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by DLJ - July 15, 2019 at 10:48 am
RE: Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? - by The Grand Nudger - July 15, 2019 at 2:47 pm

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Beauty, Morality, God, and a Table FrustratedFool 23 2141 October 8, 2023 at 1:35 pm
Last Post: LinuxGal
  Maximizing Moral Virtue h311inac311 191 13872 December 17, 2022 at 10:36 pm
Last Post: Objectivist
  As a nonreligious person, where do you get your moral guidance? Gentle_Idiot 79 7022 November 26, 2022 at 10:27 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Moral justification for the execution of criminals of war? Macoleco 184 7008 August 19, 2022 at 7:03 pm
Last Post: bennyboy
  On theism, why do humans have moral duties even if there are objective moral values? Pnerd 37 3320 May 24, 2022 at 11:49 am
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Can we trust our Moral Intuitions? vulcanlogician 72 4380 November 7, 2021 at 1:25 pm
Last Post: Alan V
  Any Moral Relativists in the House? vulcanlogician 72 5153 June 21, 2021 at 9:09 am
Last Post: vulcanlogician
  [Serious] Moral Obligations toward Possible Worlds Neo-Scholastic 93 5987 May 23, 2021 at 1:43 am
Last Post: Anomalocaris
  A Moral Reality Acrobat 29 3422 September 12, 2019 at 8:09 pm
Last Post: brewer
  In Defense of a Non-Natural Moral Order Acrobat 84 7521 August 30, 2019 at 3:02 pm
Last Post: LastPoet



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)