RE: I will prove to you that God exists
April 8, 2025 at 11:06 am
(This post was last modified: April 8, 2025 at 11:39 am by Sheldon.)
(April 8, 2025 at 10:43 am)Drew_2013 Wrote:This is hardly saying much, since the existence of the natural physical universe, and natural causation, is an objective fact, one might as well deny the rotundity of the earth.(April 7, 2025 at 5:17 pm)Mister Agenda Wrote: I wasn't going to interact with you in this thread, Drew, but are you sure most atheists deny there is evidence our existence is the result of natural forces? That seems to be the implication of not doing that while most atheists do. Doesn't really sound right.I don't deny there is evidence to support belief in naturalism.
Maybe you meant that most atheists deny evidence that our existence is NOT the result of natural forces but you do not deny that there is evidence that our existence IS the result of natural forces?
Quote:Most if not all atheists deny there is a shred of evidence, data or reason to think it was intentionally caused. They are to cowardly to admit otherwise.
Oh dear, firstly and for the second time it is too much, not to (sic) much, and the idea you know what most, let alone all, atheists think is too stupid a claim to do anything with but point and laugh. I can only speak for myself, and am happy to state categorically that I have never encountered, nor am I aware of any objective evidence that the universe was created, nor any sound argument for the same. For the record, you have failed utterly to do so.
If you think you have evidence the universe was created by a deity using supernatural powers, then present it, but you will need to a lot better than misrepresenting scientific terms like fine tuning, as this scientific term explains only natural physical attributes of the universe. It does not evidence anything supernatural, this is the core error you started with, and haven't the integrity to address.
The term fine tuning is a metaphor, like the term the big bang, nether are meant literally, and neither idea, nor any established scientific idea, has ever evidenced anything supernatural. The scientific term differs from the theological argument using that term, the apologetics argument from fine tuning, points at the natural physical characteristics of the universe, and then uses an argumentum ad ignorantiam fallacy, namely "we can't explain X, therefore god did it."
Nothing Drew has presented, goes beyond the use of that fallacy.