RE: Freedom of Religion
February 8, 2012 at 9:23 am
(This post was last modified: February 8, 2012 at 9:40 am by The Grand Nudger.)
No Abr, we're telling you that the concepts behind the terms you've used thusfar aren't mysterious or unexplained. They've been investigated, literally, to death. Have you managed to "rule out" things like trolls, elves, and Banshee? Witchcraft belongs in the same category. As does the nebulous spiritual component to reality. A statement that is vague enough to mean anything or nothing.
In Abra's defense, because I absolutely hate "you must accept this axiom" statements.....no. Abra does not have to accept an axiom at face value, no axiom makes anything possible, in and of itself. Axioms don't have such powers, any more than witches do.
@Tack. I agree, asking for material evidence for an immaterial god would be strange. Thankfully man has never been able to imagine a completely immaterial god. You've argued for "evidence that seems clear to your worldview".......was this evidence immaterial? No, it was not. Even you have proposed a god that can (at least in theory) be detected within the realm of the material (shades of Frodo btw..lol). This line of argument is essentially saying "I've made claims which I feel are beyond our ability to evidence and so they must be taken seriously, and it's pointless to question them based on evidence." Well, no you haven't, and no it isn't. "The immaterial" isn't a fortress where a person can shield whatever nutty belief they dream up (or borrow from other's imaginations) from skepticism. "This concept is completely immaterial" is a straight admission of defeat. It is exactly equivalent to saying "there is no evidence".
In Abra's defense, because I absolutely hate "you must accept this axiom" statements.....no. Abra does not have to accept an axiom at face value, no axiom makes anything possible, in and of itself. Axioms don't have such powers, any more than witches do.
@Tack. I agree, asking for material evidence for an immaterial god would be strange. Thankfully man has never been able to imagine a completely immaterial god. You've argued for "evidence that seems clear to your worldview".......was this evidence immaterial? No, it was not. Even you have proposed a god that can (at least in theory) be detected within the realm of the material (shades of Frodo btw..lol). This line of argument is essentially saying "I've made claims which I feel are beyond our ability to evidence and so they must be taken seriously, and it's pointless to question them based on evidence." Well, no you haven't, and no it isn't. "The immaterial" isn't a fortress where a person can shield whatever nutty belief they dream up (or borrow from other's imaginations) from skepticism. "This concept is completely immaterial" is a straight admission of defeat. It is exactly equivalent to saying "there is no evidence".
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