RE: Is becoming like God good or evil?
July 19, 2012 at 2:11 pm
(This post was last modified: July 19, 2012 at 2:58 pm by Godscreated.)
(July 18, 2012 at 9:05 am)Faith No More Wrote:(July 17, 2012 at 6:18 pm)Godschild Wrote:
But those are all Satan's actions. Surely god would have been able to come up with a fool proof plan, unless of course.....Yes! That's it. God wanted it to happen that way, so not only did he have a broken creation that required his salvation but he blamed the creation for his failures.
It's brilliant. Brilliantly sadistic, that is.
The plan could not have been made fool proof or any other proof, this would have eliminated choice, the choice to obey, this was God's plan, to give man freedom to choose. God did not want it to happen the way it did, He allowed man through choice to set the future.
(July 16, 2012 at 11:52 am)Godschild Wrote:
RD Wrote:Some major flaws in that comparison:
1. The Teacher does not know with certainty the result.
You can bet the teacher has a good idea what the results will be, close enough to fit well into the comparison.
RD Wrote:2. By all accounts God does not have an exam board dictating his actions.
God's omniscient and doesn't need a board, what does your statement have to do with this argument.
RD Wrote:3. Exams last a specified amount of time, this "test" did not. The time remaining was eternal making a pass impossible.
Time has nothing to do with this, you're trying to divert this discussion with nonsense, you can not know that they could not have continued to obey God forever.
RD Wrote:4. If a student fails then a teacher will alter their teaching technique according to the type of student. They do not expel them from the school after one fail.
The punishments are different because the situations are different, quit trying to side track.
RD Wrote:5. God did not offer them any education as to why the tree was important, what its function was and what its placement was meant to teach them. This is the opposite to the teachers approach as it offers minimal information.
God gave them all the knowledge they needed at creation, they understood the consequences of their disobedience, Eve told the serpent so.
RD Wrote:6. If a teachers lessons are so harsh and cruel that it traumatizes the student then it *is* the teachers fault and they should not be allowed to teach, period.
The test do not have to be harsh, if a student fails the test it's the students fault. If you're trying to say that Adam and Eve was traumatized you need to bring proof.
All and all your comparison bares little, if any, in the way of similarity.
I would strongly advise finding another and trying again if you wish to continue this debate with any kind of consistency to your argument.
RD Wrote:The fact of the matter is if God is omnipotent then it couldn't be further from the truth to say that placing the tree wasn't a choice. On the contrary, *nobody* has more choice. This means that he could of altered his approach to be more merciful and at the same time teach the lesson he wished to teach. He knew the future and therefore was capable of altering it.
He did not, this requires explanation.
If he is not omnipotent then this would explain his lack of foresight but it also means he can't know everything and therefore he does have limitations.
You cannot have it both ways unless you say this is the outcome he wished and I think you know it.
God does what He knows to be right, since He is righteous He had no choice He had to place the tree there. God saw the future that man was to make, the future was not of God's making, it's God who is working to straighten out man's mess. This was not God's desire, He however was not going to force man to do what He desired, He allowed man to have the choice. I don't need it both ways, I accept what has happened and trust God to straighten this mess out in His omniscient wisdom.
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.