Where do atheists get their morality from?

[greneknight]

The bottom line is we Christians don't know where we get our morality from. Some of us who are stupid will say THE BIBLE but any atheist can call our bluff and show us how immoral the Bible is and watch us squirm. And squirm we do like a jelly fish fresh on the sand because we know what a manic bastard our God sounds in the Bible and what gross immorality is encouraged in the Bible. We know how God is said not just to be an infanticidal genocidal maniac but also one who encourages, nay commands, the Israelite soldiers to rape prepubescent girls after killing their fathers, mothers, brothers and infant sisters.

Most Christians understand the OT God as merciful, compassionate and forgiving. Prior to each of his 'judgments' he gave warnings and allowed the people time to repent.

You've got it wrong, deceived. In the OT, God gave a lot of warnings ONLY to the Jews. Never to the rest of humanity whom he hates. If you don't know that, you obviously haven't read your Bible. If you disagree with me on this, show me what warning he gave the Midianites, the people of Ai, Jericho, the Jebussites, the Hittites, and all the other "-ites". Even if he did warn them, what about the babies. Were they warned too and did they disobey. Killing infants and raping prepubescent girls must be the most disgracefully evil thing that only a crass, hardened, base, evil and repulsively repugnant monster can do and God, according to the OT, did it.

If your view of God is that he is evil, but other parts of the Bible show him good, what do you make of such a contradicting God? If you say fabrication, there is no god to call good or bad. But if you entertain the possibility of this Christian God of the Bible being real and present, then you must resolve the apparent contradiction.

It's not an apparent contradiction. Let's not be mealy-mouthed. It's a contradiction. Face the truth for once, please. Obviously the book is wrong. God doesn't exist as a being. That's all bunkum, don't you see?

Either God has changing moods, is evil, or has a good reason for everything he does--a reason you may not understand until you study the Bible further and let God into your heart.

That is the most ludicrous suggestion I have ever heard in all my earthly existence. When a bastard is a seasoned infanticidal cum genocidal maniac (as the OT tells us God is) and if he orders soldiers to rape prepubescent girls after murdering their parents and brothers and infant sisters, such a bastard is EVIL beyond words. There can be no reason so compelling as to justify the action of such an uncompromisingly evil beastly bastard. What you are suggesting is I should have myself brainwashed so that I can believe in an evil filthy ogre and not allow his bastardy to affect my humanistic sense of justice. I'm afraid jettisoning my reason and rational thinking and having myself brainwashed is something I won't allow. If you allow yourself to be brainwashed, you could serve anyone - even the most beastly monster.

If he has changing moods, the NT God is the latest version and He is wonderful!

No, I do not see the NT God to be wonderful. OK, his bastardy has been reduced and he no longer kills infants and orders the rape of prepubescent girls. But he's not much pleasanter either. He killed Ananias and Saphira in Acts 5. I'm only taking what the NT says. Of course I don't for a minute believe that there is a bogeyman in the sky who can do such a thing.

If God seems evil, on what grounds?

Ho Ho Ho! You have the gall to ask on what grounds? On the grounds of human decency that thankfully you share too or you'd be going on a rape-cum-murder rampage and if you were to follow the Bible, you'd probably do it on a much grander scale.

We are made in his image, able to see goodness and evil as He sees them.

Says who? Says the writer of that story that also talks about how God killed infants and ordered soldiers to rape prepubescent girls? Sorry, the writer of the story is a bastard himself to conceive such a nasty story in his dirty little head and he should have placed a rating on his work. I'm underaged and shouldn't read such smut as the Bible.

What would God gain by torturing us? Pleasure? You seem to put yourself above God, calling this pleasure wrong or illogical--using a standard He gave you, setting up God to do something that's already senseless in your mind. A strawman, if you will.

How would I know what God would gain by torturing humans? Ask the writers of smut who wrote the x-rated Bible. They should know what they had in mind for their fictional Voldemort.

This is funny. You are saying God tortures people for pleasure. And I'm wrong to call this pleasure that God has wrong or illogical. So what are you saying? That I should say God's pleasure in torturing people is right and logical. Let God enjoy his sadistic pleasure in private.

Now the third possibility--that God has a decent reason--is the more plausible of the list in that it does not attempt to make God a dumber being than ourselves. A son does not understand what his father does until he is older, but he trusts his judgment. He may think being sent to his room a crass injustice. But the father loves his son then and now--through the lessons of the Old Testament to the harvesting of love in the New. And when the boy grows up, his eyes are opened.

My eyes will open when I grow up. I don't know what I'll be when I grow up but I do hope I will never grow up to think it's all right for a genocidal infanticidal maniac to go on his rampage and to order soldiers to rape prepubescent girls and to send she-bears to rip apart 42 children who merely teased a prophet "bald head". I hope I will have the decency to despise such a fictional character and to hate it with all my heart and to grow up NOT to be like this filthy, vile and evil monstrosity.

I believe your real argument is not that God is evil, but that the scriptures were fabricated by man. That is a discussion for another time. Try reading a couple books by Christian theologians, such as Is God a Moral Monster? Making Sense of the Old Testament God by Copan. Theologians are better experts on the Bible than a biologist like Richard Dawkins. A knowledgeable believer can reconcile the NT and OT Gods using the scriptures. We believe God is good, as evidenced by the sacrifice of His son Jesus. You believe God is evil, and base that judgment on hasty conclusions and popular media. This matter should not be taken lightly, but thoroughly investigated. Have you read the Bible completely through, Greneknight?

No, of course I haven't read the whole Bible. It's boring and stupid. But I think you don't understand my stand. I do believe the Bible is fabricated by a bunch of ancient and ignorant men but I don't believe God exists as a being. I've discussed this with a few priests and they think it's a viable option although not all of them agree with me. I come to this conclusion after reading about God in the Bible. The Bible leads me to this conclusion.

God does not exist. But humans have culture. Our culture is Christian because of where we were born in. Stories are always told to make people conform and be better. Our stories take the shape of the Christian God. So, God is a metaphor for goodness truth and justice. But he (we use the personal pronoun by tradition) does not have independent will or thought because he's merely a metaphor.

This is the only way you can reconcile the Bible with the faith. The priests I told you about said this was one viable way to express my faith but I should remain under the "authority" of Holy Church. So, I should continue serving as an altar boy and until I was pulled out of the choir last Easter because I've reached an age when my voice is going to break, a choir boy. I've been an altar boy since 5 and a choir boy since 6. I'm not a rebellious person so I don't need to be an atheist. I have no ego issues so I don't mind genuflecting, bowing, kneeling, crossing myself, clasping my hands, carrying the candlesticks, carrying that ridiculously large ceremonial Bible, chanting, singing, praying, turning to the East and all the other things that some people might feel too proud to do.