RE: Where do atheists get their morality from?
September 17, 2012 at 4:22 am
(This post was last modified: September 17, 2012 at 4:25 am by Angrboda.)
(September 17, 2012 at 2:32 am)Polaris Wrote: That was evidence I just found by a five-minute search and was half the evidence I posted.
And now you have all the time you need. I'm patient. I'll wait.
(September 17, 2012 at 2:32 am)Polaris Wrote: You know that secular implies that there is a separation between itself and religion, right?
Define "separation" as you apply it here. According to both your source and the Oxford English Dictionary, the two are simply the absence of the other.
(September 17, 2012 at 2:32 am)Polaris Wrote: It started with the Neanderthals as I probably already stated especially since the other two were not around at the time the Neanderthals were developing their worship.
Evidence?
(While the Denisovan specimen found dated to 41 Kya, genomic sequencing dated the divergence of the Neanderthal and Denisovan lines at 600-650 Kya. Proto-Neanderthal arrived in Europe 350-600 Kya. And for those of you playing along at home, this means our lucky contestant now has to provide evidence for the social lives of, not one, but two species, from at least 600,000 years ago. Are you ready contestant?)
(September 17, 2012 at 2:32 am)Polaris Wrote: The Denisova DNA strand is only expressed in a small number of people (ethnic Oceanians) and was a rather late addition, around the time of the Cro-Magnon.
It's being expressed in a small number of people is irrelevant. And I won't pretend to be knowledgeable about the sequencing of the genomes and such, but it is not clear to me why the Denisovan DNA in the human genome couldn't have come by way of inter-breeding between Neanderthal and Denisovan at any time during the 600,000 year co-existence. But, as noted, I'm not an expert on that, so if you know different, please let me know. (With a citation from the scientific literature.)
However, do note, what is at issue here is not when Denisovan interbred with homo sapiens, but whether there was interbreeding — or even contact — between Neanderthal and Denisovan prior to the first evidence of religious or secular culture in either. Since Denisovan diverged from Neanderthal (which we know from genomic sequencing), the suggestion that they didn't have contact with each other between their divergence at ~640 Kya and the first cultural artifacts of either is gonna be rather difficult to prove. But I won't prejudge you; show me what you've got.
Breaking news... dit.. dit.. dit.. dit..
The earliest cultural assemblages for Neanderthal are the Mousterian cultural artifacts, dated at 300,000 years ago. Do you know what that means contestant? Yes, it means that Denisovan and Neanderthal may have co-existed for as long as 300,000 years prior to any cultural artifacts for either of them that we know of currently. "Ouch! That's gotta hurt!"
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