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Orwell's 1984 and Bradbury's Fahrenheit 451 combined?
#28
RE: Orwell's 1984 and Bradbury's Fahrenheit 451 combined?
(November 3, 2012 at 11:31 pm)cratehorus Wrote:
Quote:Eritrea is a totalitarian state, as is Rwanda and Ethiopia, North Korea and Cuba are also generally considered surviving totalitarian systems.
This isn't about totalitarianism this is anti-communist propaganda, the exact same type that was used in the cold war, He blames totalitarianism yet does not include suadi arabia Iran but includes north korea and Cuba, what do they have to with africa????
Absolutely nothing. This was intended to be examples of other totalitarian systems in the world, not an all inclusive list. Saudi Arabia and some other middle eastern and African regimes, such as Equatorial Guinea, correspond to Max Weber's definition of sultanistic regimes, which are a close cousin to totalitarian regimes. However, these systems are based on theocratic or nepotistic principles rather than an overarching political ideology. Iran is arguably a theocracy, and although repressive does contain some social autonomy and democratic elements, therefore, it is not totalitarian.

(November 2, 2012 at 7:01 pm)cratehorus Wrote: It is absurd that you should suggest this.
why? he makes no case against fascism and is also painting the Rwanda massacres as some kind of leftist revolt, this is hysteria, the genocide was caused by decades of european colonialism, they seperated the races by which looked the most WHITE, there is no such thing as hutu or tootsi these are foreign imagined races defined by the Germans, this has nothing to do with communism so WHAAAAT???? is this part about rwanda???? This the same old line, of communists and nazis are the same thing just one speaks russian, and one speaks german
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The colonial legacy was significant in the Rwandan conflict, however, the fundamental problem there was political. The problem is fundamentally a struggle for political power, not ethnic dominance.

(November 2, 2012 at 7:01 pm)cratehorus Wrote: how can you say the eritrean secret police the EPRD (which he even admits was disbanded in 1989 wink) is the KGB, a bunch of half starved prisoners who can barely aim a gun are not the same as CIA of the Soviet Union. Yet you don't beleive that if FOX news did some shitty story about written by 14 year old about alqueada and showed a guy wearing a turban in the desert with a AK-47 with the caption reading Asmara, Eritrea a since most americans have never heard of this ocuntry before, everyone would beleive it? why?????
The police apparatus in Eritrea is still alive and well. The fact of the matter is, Eritrean prisons are filled with thousands of people who have been caught trying to flee the country or avoid military service, which is compulsory. There are more journalists imprisoned in Eritrea than anywhere else in the world, per Reporters without Borders. The entire population lives in fear.

(November 2, 2012 at 7:01 pm)cratehorus Wrote: completley leaving out the fact that outside infulences even exist in africa by simpy dimissing the whole country as isolationists,
Quote:A state can be totalitarian without being isolationist. It is convenient to control information in a totalitarian system, and therefore many totalitarian systems are relatively isolated.
so by isolationist he's refering strictly to the media which i imagine is due to propganda laws in this country something many fascist dictatorships have. But changing this words defintion as well to make his point that communism is what's wrong with africa, and fascism isn't perfect but if those are the only to choices fascism is the better one
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Not quite sure how you are getting a pro-fascist argument from this piece? Both communism and fascism are totalitarian ideologies, which very few people would assert are positive for those living under such systems of governance.

(November 2, 2012 at 7:01 pm)cratehorus Wrote: there might not be "international headlines" but there are news reports, that your government chooses not too accept based on "legitamacy concerns"
Quote:Very few outsiders are allowed to travel to Eritrea. There is no independent press. Simply because North Korean press says something does not mean it is true, it is the same in the case of Eritrea, any press coming out of the country has been screened by the government.
independent from whom?? there are about 5 US media companies?? how many exist in Eritrea? again this is an argument about media isolationism presented as Eritrea being somewhere that people aren't allowed into asi if, it's in a walled off castle ontop of a very steep mountain, this is on the red sea, next the damned Suez Canal............. one of the largest busiest shipping routes in the world, DID THEY BUILD A FUCKING FENCE I DON'T KNOW ABOUT?
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Nope, no fence you don't know about. They still have more journalists imprisoned than anywhere else on the globe. This piece is about totalitarian systems in Africa, it is not intended to be a defense of the American media. The American media is not controlled by the US government, however much it may be dominated by a handful of companies.

(November 2, 2012 at 7:01 pm)cratehorus Wrote:



I would love to stick to rwanda and eritrea right now, because I imagine he's using Ethiopia more as an 'example' of a large scale widespread "slightly dilluted" version of what's happening in Eritrea. Do you have any more, maybe something more specific about Rwanda? does he mention their history at all or does the whole thing start at kagame's presidecy like nothing ever happened before, I have a secret for you Rwanda isn't proud of it's shitty heritage (not everyone is) norare they "proud" of it's shitty white man's name, for its shitty heavily poinoned land or it's people

the whole things reads like "the Cherokee's are so proud of the their American heritage".......sounds right! but ummmmmmm no the fuck it's not
And this is devolving... rapidly... The points you are making are making less and less sense. You have obviously never been to any of these places and it is unclear where you are getting your information. My husband last visited Eritrea in 1992, but has since been unable to get a visa. He last visited Rwanda, Ethiopia, and Equatorial Guinea in July 2012. Your objective seems to be to denounce the US government or dismiss this piece as a work of American propaganda. I'm bored with this. I feel I have made the case that totalitarian systems do exist, which was my original intent. I'm over my case of, "Someone is wrong on the internet." You can be wrong, it's fine by me.
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Messages In This Thread
RE: Orwell's 1984 and Bradbury's Fahrenheit 451 combined? - by festive1 - November 4, 2012 at 9:23 am

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