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Show me your proof
#15
RE: Show me your proof
(April 7, 2013 at 4:48 am)Mr_Dew7 Wrote: I just want to see what proof you have for or against God. Not intending to turn this into a nasty debate, I just want to hear what you all have to say about the subject of the God that I believe in, from every religious view. If you would be so kind!

I don't have proof for god, nor against him. I was raised a Christian and followed it loyally for many years, but in the end I think that needing to shape god to fit the evidence simply made it feel as if I was excusing him for never showing up. The rationalizations I used felt like just that; I wasn't explaining why others couldn't find god, I was trying to explain why I couldn't. And that eroded my faith.

I see people doing that now and I remember my own efforts to explain why god doesn't make his existence evident to us in as clear a manner as possible. I remember thinking that few people ever bothered to search for god the right way or must have failed to fulfill some minor requirement or just didn't really want to find him. Those were all very condescending and rude ways to look at it, but the only other option was to admit that they'd made an honest effort and found nothing. And then I realized that I had also made an honest effort and found nothing. Which is why I just smile sadly when someone gives me some version of 'you didn't do it right.'

I think that a god that cares as much as his followers believe he does --as I believed he did-- would make his existence obvious. Instead, I was taught that he made us capable of great feats of intellect and reason, but only rewards those who abandon intellect and reason for emotion and intuition. He seemed so crude and petty, and that was incomprehensible. When I began to read about how ancient people created and shaped their gods, the god of the Bible began to make a lot more sense. Much more sense than the one I tried to pretend was real.
"Well, evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts. Facts don't go away when scientists debate rival theories to explain them. Einstein's theory of gravitation replaced Newton's in this century, but apples didn't suspend themselves in midair, pending the outcome. And humans evolved from ape- like ancestors whether they did so by Darwin's proposed mechanism or by some other yet to be discovered."

-Stephen Jay Gould
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Messages In This Thread
Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 7, 2013 at 4:48 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Darwinian - April 7, 2013 at 5:04 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Godschild - April 7, 2013 at 5:48 am
RE: Show me your proof - by pocaracas - April 7, 2013 at 5:53 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Minimalist - April 8, 2013 at 2:27 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Tonus - April 8, 2013 at 5:36 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mister Agenda - April 8, 2013 at 4:24 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Godschild - April 8, 2013 at 11:15 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Darkstar - April 8, 2013 at 11:18 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Godschild - April 9, 2013 at 1:41 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Darkstar - April 9, 2013 at 2:05 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Mister Agenda - April 9, 2013 at 9:35 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Faith No More - April 9, 2013 at 2:30 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Godschild - April 9, 2013 at 8:11 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Baalzebutt - April 9, 2013 at 9:44 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 7, 2013 at 6:00 am
RE: Show me your proof - by paulpablo - April 7, 2013 at 7:09 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Zen Badger - April 7, 2013 at 8:23 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 7, 2013 at 8:41 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Zen Badger - April 7, 2013 at 9:05 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 7, 2013 at 9:25 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Darkstar - April 7, 2013 at 2:53 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Zen Badger - April 8, 2013 at 4:27 am
RE: Show me your proof - by archangle - April 8, 2013 at 8:00 am
RE: Show me your proof - by paulpablo - April 7, 2013 at 5:13 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mystical - April 7, 2013 at 5:15 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Godschild - April 7, 2013 at 5:54 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 7, 2013 at 7:22 am
RE: Show me your proof - by popeyespappy - April 7, 2013 at 10:31 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mystical - April 9, 2013 at 12:33 am
RE: Show me your proof - by fr0d0 - April 9, 2013 at 2:12 am
RE: Show me your proof - by radorth - April 13, 2013 at 12:50 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Esquilax - April 13, 2013 at 4:07 am
RE: Show me your proof - by archangle - April 13, 2013 at 6:58 am
RE: Show me your proof - by FallentoReason - April 16, 2013 at 10:32 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Mononoke - April 7, 2013 at 5:33 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Paraselene - April 7, 2013 at 5:53 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Kayenneh - April 7, 2013 at 6:02 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Tonus - April 7, 2013 at 7:39 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 7, 2013 at 7:53 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Kayenneh - April 7, 2013 at 7:50 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 7, 2013 at 8:13 am
RE: Show me your proof - by My imaginary friend is GOD - April 7, 2013 at 8:30 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 7, 2013 at 8:54 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 7, 2013 at 9:13 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 7, 2013 at 9:21 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Paraselene - April 7, 2013 at 9:24 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 7, 2013 at 9:29 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Paraselene - April 7, 2013 at 9:31 am
RE: Show me your proof - by MysticKnight - April 7, 2013 at 9:33 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Paraselene - April 7, 2013 at 9:40 am
RE: Show me your proof - by MysticKnight - April 7, 2013 at 10:12 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Paraselene - April 7, 2013 at 10:18 am
RE: Show me your proof - by catfish - April 7, 2013 at 10:20 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 7, 2013 at 10:31 am
RE: Show me your proof - by catfish - April 8, 2013 at 6:43 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Baalzebutt - April 8, 2013 at 6:45 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Darkstar - April 8, 2013 at 6:51 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by catfish - April 8, 2013 at 7:14 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by MysticKnight - April 7, 2013 at 10:26 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 7, 2013 at 10:07 am
RE: Show me your proof - by MysticKnight - April 7, 2013 at 9:42 am
RE: Show me your proof - by My imaginary friend is GOD - April 7, 2013 at 9:27 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 7, 2013 at 9:38 am
RE: Show me your proof - by My imaginary friend is GOD - April 7, 2013 at 9:42 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 7, 2013 at 10:24 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Zen Badger - April 7, 2013 at 9:31 am
RE: Show me your proof - by MysticKnight - April 7, 2013 at 8:59 am
RE: Show me your proof - by My imaginary friend is GOD - April 7, 2013 at 9:07 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Paraselene - April 7, 2013 at 9:10 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Jackalope - April 8, 2013 at 4:47 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by My imaginary friend is GOD - April 7, 2013 at 8:06 am
RE: Show me your proof - by MysticKnight - April 7, 2013 at 8:10 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 7, 2013 at 8:31 am
RE: Show me your proof - by MysticKnight - April 7, 2013 at 8:37 am
RE: Show me your proof - by MysticKnight - April 7, 2013 at 8:53 am
RE: Show me your proof - by My imaginary friend is GOD - April 7, 2013 at 8:54 am
RE: Show me your proof - by MysticKnight - April 7, 2013 at 9:28 am
RE: Show me your proof - by catfish - April 7, 2013 at 9:41 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 7, 2013 at 10:17 am
RE: Show me your proof - by catfish - April 7, 2013 at 10:36 am
RE: Show me your proof - by CleanShavenJesus - April 7, 2013 at 12:05 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by paulpablo - April 7, 2013 at 1:55 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Whateverist - April 7, 2013 at 4:03 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by ThomM - April 7, 2013 at 7:07 pm
Re: RE: Show me your proof - by frz - April 8, 2013 at 12:34 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Godschild - April 8, 2013 at 1:32 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Fruity - April 8, 2013 at 1:16 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Godschild - April 8, 2013 at 1:37 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 8, 2013 at 1:36 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Cato - April 8, 2013 at 2:09 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mr_Dew7 - April 8, 2013 at 2:24 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Whateverist - April 8, 2013 at 10:02 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Fruity - April 8, 2013 at 1:45 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Godschild - April 8, 2013 at 11:19 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by KichigaiNeko - April 8, 2013 at 4:48 am
RE: Show me your proof - by fr0d0 - April 8, 2013 at 7:45 am
RE: Show me your proof - by CleanShavenJesus - April 8, 2013 at 5:14 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Darwinian - April 8, 2013 at 7:46 am
RE: Show me your proof - by thesummerqueen - April 8, 2013 at 9:53 am
Re: Show me your proof - by frz - April 8, 2013 at 3:17 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by downbeatplumb - April 8, 2013 at 3:23 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Fruity - April 9, 2013 at 1:39 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Godschild - April 9, 2013 at 2:38 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Baalzebutt - April 9, 2013 at 11:56 am
RE: Show me your proof - by MysticKnight - April 9, 2013 at 12:07 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by archangle - April 9, 2013 at 12:04 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Baalzebutt - April 9, 2013 at 12:14 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by MysticKnight - April 9, 2013 at 1:36 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Baalzebutt - April 9, 2013 at 1:59 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by MysticKnight - April 9, 2013 at 3:58 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by fr0d0 - April 9, 2013 at 4:19 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Mystical - April 9, 2013 at 1:48 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mystical - April 9, 2013 at 2:51 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Fruity - April 9, 2013 at 2:38 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Baalzebutt - April 9, 2013 at 2:55 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Godschild - April 9, 2013 at 10:02 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Fidel_Castronaut - April 10, 2013 at 9:49 am
RE: Show me your proof - by ThomM - April 11, 2013 at 9:51 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by fr0d0 - April 12, 2013 at 1:03 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Esquilax - April 13, 2013 at 12:35 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Baalzebutt - April 10, 2013 at 11:37 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Esquilax - April 10, 2013 at 3:17 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Baalzebutt - April 10, 2013 at 3:26 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Tonus - April 10, 2013 at 3:30 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Baalzebutt - April 10, 2013 at 3:42 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Fidel_Castronaut - April 9, 2013 at 2:41 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Fruity - April 9, 2013 at 3:47 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Baalzebutt - April 9, 2013 at 4:35 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by fr0d0 - April 9, 2013 at 4:56 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Baalzebutt - April 9, 2013 at 4:57 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Mystical - April 9, 2013 at 9:42 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Mystical - April 14, 2013 at 12:38 am
RE: Show me your proof - by fr0d0 - April 14, 2013 at 4:21 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mystical - April 14, 2013 at 4:58 am
RE: Show me your proof - by The Grand Nudger - April 14, 2013 at 9:41 am
RE: Show me your proof - by A_Nony_Mouse - April 14, 2013 at 9:54 am
RE: Show me your proof - by radorth - April 16, 2013 at 9:45 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by A_Nony_Mouse - April 17, 2013 at 3:10 am
RE: Show me your proof - by catfish - April 14, 2013 at 10:28 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Mystical - April 17, 2013 at 4:00 am
RE: Show me your proof - by A_Nony_Mouse - April 17, 2013 at 5:06 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Tonus - April 17, 2013 at 5:41 am
RE: Show me your proof - by A_Nony_Mouse - April 17, 2013 at 7:34 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Tonus - April 17, 2013 at 8:57 am
RE: Show me your proof - by A_Nony_Mouse - April 17, 2013 at 10:45 am
RE: Show me your proof - by smax - April 18, 2013 at 12:12 am
RE: Show me your proof - by A_Nony_Mouse - April 18, 2013 at 10:25 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Tex - April 18, 2013 at 1:13 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Esquilax - April 18, 2013 at 2:44 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Tex - April 18, 2013 at 7:11 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by A_Nony_Mouse - April 18, 2013 at 10:45 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Tex - April 18, 2013 at 6:52 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by pocaracas - April 18, 2013 at 7:10 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by A_Nony_Mouse - April 18, 2013 at 8:19 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by smax - April 18, 2013 at 11:37 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Tex - April 19, 2013 at 3:23 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by pocaracas - April 19, 2013 at 5:19 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Tex - April 19, 2013 at 5:47 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by catfish - April 19, 2013 at 5:47 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by smax - April 20, 2013 at 6:47 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Tex - April 23, 2013 at 11:13 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Paraselene - April 23, 2013 at 11:17 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by smax - April 18, 2013 at 2:17 am
RE: Show me your proof - by smax - April 18, 2013 at 3:46 am
RE: Show me your proof - by The Grand Nudger - April 18, 2013 at 9:20 am
RE: Show me your proof - by The Grand Nudger - April 18, 2013 at 10:31 am
RE: Show me your proof - by pocaracas - April 18, 2013 at 10:54 am
RE: Show me your proof - by A_Nony_Mouse - April 18, 2013 at 11:05 am
RE: Show me your proof - by The Grand Nudger - April 18, 2013 at 10:59 am
RE: Show me your proof - by pocaracas - April 18, 2013 at 11:06 am
RE: Show me your proof - by A_Nony_Mouse - April 18, 2013 at 11:12 am
RE: Show me your proof - by catfish - April 18, 2013 at 7:15 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by pocaracas - April 18, 2013 at 7:19 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by downbeatplumb - April 19, 2013 at 12:13 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Tex - April 18, 2013 at 10:34 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by catfish - April 18, 2013 at 7:36 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Tonus - April 18, 2013 at 7:59 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by catfish - April 18, 2013 at 8:09 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by The Grand Nudger - April 19, 2013 at 10:14 am
Re: Show me your proof - by NoraBrimstone - April 19, 2013 at 5:27 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by pocaracas - April 19, 2013 at 6:35 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Tex - April 19, 2013 at 8:00 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Tonus - April 19, 2013 at 7:18 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by The Grand Nudger - April 19, 2013 at 8:10 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Tex - April 19, 2013 at 9:00 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by A_Nony_Mouse - April 19, 2013 at 9:29 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Tex - April 20, 2013 at 6:39 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by ThomM - April 21, 2013 at 1:21 am
RE: Show me your proof - by A_Nony_Mouse - April 21, 2013 at 10:47 am
RE: Show me your proof - by The Grand Nudger - April 19, 2013 at 9:18 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by The Grand Nudger - April 19, 2013 at 9:30 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Gearbreak - April 20, 2013 at 7:19 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Tex - April 23, 2013 at 11:29 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Cyberman - April 23, 2013 at 11:36 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Tex - April 23, 2013 at 11:45 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Paraselene - April 23, 2013 at 11:57 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Cyberman - April 24, 2013 at 12:10 am
RE: Show me your proof - by smax - April 24, 2013 at 10:25 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Esquilax - April 24, 2013 at 12:09 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Cyberman - April 23, 2013 at 11:54 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Tex - April 24, 2013 at 5:47 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Cyberman - April 24, 2013 at 6:44 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Tex - April 24, 2013 at 9:37 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Esquilax - April 24, 2013 at 10:45 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Tex - April 25, 2013 at 4:42 am
RE: Show me your proof - by smax - April 25, 2013 at 3:19 am
RE: Show me your proof - by The Grand Nudger - April 24, 2013 at 9:20 am
RE: Show me your proof - by purplepurpose - April 24, 2013 at 1:02 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Cyberman - April 24, 2013 at 3:45 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Tonus - April 24, 2013 at 1:03 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by The Grand Nudger - April 24, 2013 at 1:04 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by purplepurpose - April 24, 2013 at 1:17 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by The Grand Nudger - April 24, 2013 at 1:21 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by The Grand Nudger - April 24, 2013 at 5:51 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by The Grand Nudger - April 24, 2013 at 9:56 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Bad Wolf - May 11, 2013 at 11:14 am
RE: Show me your proof - by fr0d0 - May 12, 2013 at 2:07 am
RE: Show me your proof - by Bad Wolf - May 12, 2013 at 8:16 am
RE: Show me your proof - by fr0d0 - May 12, 2013 at 9:57 am
RE: Show me your proof - by catfish - May 12, 2013 at 10:42 am
RE: Show me your proof - by fr0d0 - May 12, 2013 at 11:49 am
RE: Show me your proof - by catfish - May 12, 2013 at 12:00 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by fr0d0 - May 12, 2013 at 2:59 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by Cyberman - May 12, 2013 at 9:41 pm
RE: Show me your proof - by fr0d0 - May 13, 2013 at 1:43 am

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