(April 28, 2013 at 4:17 pm)downbeatplumb Wrote: So in your fantasy something completely non-material, that is to say an abstract thing like "taste in music" somehow poofed the universe into existence!
Not even close. In fact, I'm not even sure where this comes from. I'll just assume you're talking about Existence.
Existence is not within me. My taste of music is subjective. Colors, to an extent, are subjective. My own preferences have nothing to do with my explanation. Existence is outside of me. I exist, but I am not the source of my own existence, lest I beg the question.
The only valid way to refute this is to say that there is no "I" and become a nihilist.
(April 28, 2013 at 4:17 pm)downbeatplumb Wrote: I would say that the odds are that something material happened, probably something to do with "quantum".
(sarcasm)Huh? What's that?(/sarcasm)
Quantum doesn't explain anything. Quantum can legitimately say, "In the observed area, the amount of matter changed without a known cause" but it cannot say "Therefore matter just moves around without cause" because "...matter changed without a known cause". Quantum is attempting to overstep its bounds.
(April 28, 2013 at 4:17 pm)downbeatplumb Wrote: Just because we don't know what happened dosen't mean we can't point to what didn't, I will say, with a great deal of confidence, that god did not create the universe.
Whatever happened, unless it is innately uncaused, is not the first cause. Ever. The only innately uncaused thing possible is Existence itself.
(April 28, 2013 at 4:17 pm)downbeatplumb Wrote: I can say this because every time a mystery has been solved it has turned out not to be magic.
I don't believe in magic either. No qualms.
The Lord bless you and keep you; the Lord make his face to shine upon you and be gracious to you; the Lord lift up his countenance upon you and give you peace.
