Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: August 4, 2025, 7:22 am

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
rational naturalism is impossible!
#96
RE: rational naturalism is impossible!
(October 8, 2013 at 3:22 am)genkaus Wrote: [. . .] you seem to have lost the perspective within this thread. The central issue here is if the fact that our rational processes evolved in any way compromises their ability to determine the truth. You seem to be arguing that, in fact, it is impossible for our perceptual and conceptual faculties to determine the whole truth, which means - what, exactly? That they are inherently compromised for determining any truth?

Not at all. You can determine truth in the context of your abilities. You can see bricks and mortar, and you can test how they perform in different conditions, and with experience you can build a bridge that stands for a long time. You can observe objects pulling toward each other in space, infer the math behind gravity, and use it to infer massive bodies though you can't see them.

However, when you want to use those abilities to establish whether they are child to a parent, this is impossible. If they ARE child to a parent, i.e. a subset of all possible perceptions, then humans are intrinsically limited. If they ARE NOT child to a parent, i.e. there is no perception which (at least with the aid of technology) we are unable to explore, then we're fine.

But here's the question-- how do you use a subset to establish truths about its parent, or to establish that there is no parent? As far as I know, this is impossible.
Reply



Messages In This Thread
rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 4, 2013 at 1:26 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by FallentoReason - October 4, 2013 at 1:38 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Ryantology - October 4, 2013 at 1:42 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 4, 2013 at 1:52 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Cato - October 4, 2013 at 3:05 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by genkaus - October 4, 2013 at 2:16 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by bennyboy - October 4, 2013 at 2:28 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by genkaus - October 4, 2013 at 4:14 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by FallentoReason - October 4, 2013 at 4:33 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by genkaus - October 4, 2013 at 4:59 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by FallentoReason - October 4, 2013 at 9:10 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by FallentoReason - October 4, 2013 at 2:43 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Ryantology - October 4, 2013 at 3:10 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by FallentoReason - October 4, 2013 at 3:11 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by bennyboy - October 4, 2013 at 2:45 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Esquilax - October 4, 2013 at 3:44 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Mister Agenda - October 4, 2013 at 12:06 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by max-greece - October 7, 2013 at 1:35 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by bennyboy - October 7, 2013 at 2:53 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by downbeatplumb - October 7, 2013 at 2:58 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by genkaus - October 8, 2013 at 3:22 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by bennyboy - October 9, 2013 at 9:21 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Ryantology - October 4, 2013 at 3:14 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by FallentoReason - October 4, 2013 at 3:17 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Ryantology - October 4, 2013 at 3:28 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by FallentoReason - October 4, 2013 at 3:39 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by max-greece - October 4, 2013 at 3:52 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Chas - October 4, 2013 at 5:20 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by pocaracas - October 4, 2013 at 6:27 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 4, 2013 at 8:15 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by genkaus - October 4, 2013 at 10:06 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Faith No More - October 4, 2013 at 10:28 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 4, 2013 at 11:12 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Faith No More - October 4, 2013 at 11:25 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Esquilax - October 4, 2013 at 11:27 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 4, 2013 at 11:56 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Esquilax - October 4, 2013 at 12:06 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 4, 2013 at 7:16 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by pocaracas - October 4, 2013 at 7:44 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 4, 2013 at 8:01 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by pocaracas - October 4, 2013 at 8:26 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Faith No More - October 4, 2013 at 8:06 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by genkaus - October 5, 2013 at 1:02 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 4, 2013 at 8:16 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Faith No More - October 4, 2013 at 8:32 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 4, 2013 at 8:42 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Faith No More - October 4, 2013 at 8:58 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 4, 2013 at 9:05 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Faith No More - October 4, 2013 at 9:19 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 4, 2013 at 9:25 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by bennyboy - October 4, 2013 at 9:38 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 4, 2013 at 9:49 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by bennyboy - October 4, 2013 at 11:09 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 5, 2013 at 6:23 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by bennyboy - October 5, 2013 at 7:28 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Whateverist - October 5, 2013 at 9:07 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 5, 2013 at 1:40 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by DeistPaladin - October 6, 2013 at 10:14 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Whateverist - October 6, 2013 at 11:37 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 9, 2013 at 6:44 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by DeistPaladin - October 9, 2013 at 1:49 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by downbeatplumb - October 9, 2013 at 2:01 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by DeistPaladin - October 5, 2013 at 10:30 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by genkaus - October 5, 2013 at 1:49 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 5, 2013 at 7:46 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by bennyboy - October 5, 2013 at 8:12 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by genkaus - October 6, 2013 at 1:03 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 6, 2013 at 1:19 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by genkaus - October 6, 2013 at 1:56 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 6, 2013 at 2:31 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by genkaus - October 6, 2013 at 3:23 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by DeistPaladin - October 5, 2013 at 12:25 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Esquilax - October 5, 2013 at 4:10 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Chas - October 4, 2013 at 11:42 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by bennyboy - October 4, 2013 at 11:55 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Chas - October 5, 2013 at 12:14 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by bennyboy - October 5, 2013 at 3:42 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Chas - October 5, 2013 at 7:50 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by bennyboy - October 5, 2013 at 8:34 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by DeistPaladin - October 5, 2013 at 12:01 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Whateverist - October 5, 2013 at 12:03 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by FallentoReason - October 5, 2013 at 12:15 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Whateverist - October 5, 2013 at 12:44 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by FallentoReason - October 5, 2013 at 12:59 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Simon Moon - October 5, 2013 at 9:41 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by max-greece - October 6, 2013 at 4:10 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Angrboda - October 6, 2013 at 2:16 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by KichigaiNeko - October 6, 2013 at 4:46 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by bennyboy - October 6, 2013 at 7:58 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by max-greece - October 7, 2013 at 1:31 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by DeistPaladin - October 8, 2013 at 8:24 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 9, 2013 at 5:41 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by DeistPaladin - October 9, 2013 at 12:58 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by FallentoReason - October 9, 2013 at 5:47 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 9, 2013 at 8:02 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by pocaracas - October 9, 2013 at 9:17 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Rational AKD - October 9, 2013 at 11:08 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by pocaracas - October 9, 2013 at 11:36 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Dunno - October 9, 2013 at 4:40 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Whateverist - October 25, 2013 at 9:41 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Cheerful Charlie - October 27, 2013 at 8:34 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by bennyboy - October 28, 2013 at 7:16 am
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Cheerful Charlie - October 29, 2013 at 5:23 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by Cheerful Charlie - October 29, 2013 at 7:32 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by DeistPaladin - October 29, 2013 at 8:48 pm
RE: rational naturalism is impossible! - by TheBeardedDude - November 1, 2013 at 3:05 pm

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  If people were 100% rational, would the world be better? vulcanlogician 188 36140 August 30, 2021 at 4:37 pm
Last Post: vulcanlogician
  Describing the impossible robvalue 21 3650 October 11, 2018 at 4:33 pm
Last Post: Dr H
  An easy proof that rational numbers are countable. Jehanne 7 2824 February 22, 2018 at 10:30 pm
Last Post: Jehanne
  Is the fear of irrational fears rational? ErGingerbreadMandude 26 8335 August 13, 2017 at 9:48 pm
Last Post: Losty
  Is there a logical, rational reason why hate is bad? WisdomOfTheTrees 27 5632 February 4, 2017 at 10:43 pm
Last Post: BrianSoddingBoru4
  Your position on naturalism robvalue 125 25440 November 26, 2016 at 4:00 am
Last Post: Ignorant
  Presumption of naturalism Captain Scarlet 18 5155 September 15, 2015 at 10:49 am
Last Post: robvalue
  In regard to the rational person's choice Mohammed1212 23 7672 April 27, 2015 at 5:44 pm
Last Post: noctalla
  Idealism is more Rational than Materialism Rational AKD 158 55477 February 12, 2015 at 4:51 am
Last Post: robvalue
  Is sanity rational? bennyboy 32 9249 October 5, 2014 at 1:51 am
Last Post: Whateverist



Users browsing this thread: 2 Guest(s)