Believing Vs Claiming to Believe

[ronedee]

Interesting. Thanks for playing along. Keep in mind the conditions of our thought experiment. While I appreciate your honesty in your description of the type of communication you have with God, I'm sure I'll get no argument from you when I point out that The Bible, and Christians all over the world often tell of a more direct communication.

Assuming you're still game here, and willing to continue running with this-In this scenario, God is literally speaking to you, and is doing so with your unmistaken clarity. I'm sure you believe this to be a possible thing for God to do should he feel it necessary. I'll get back to it in a moment.

Before I forget, I am curious about something you said. You graciously acknowledged your role in the scenario, and you said that if you were certain that God was telling you to kill, you would tell him "No", and the reason you would offer God for defying him was that God told you not to? Are you saying that the two instructions could somehow be orders given by separate Gods?

Secondly, I found the defense you were prepared to give God should he take issue with you defiance puzzling. The 7th commandment. You wouldn't feel morally compelled not to comply with that order?

For example, following the outline given in the aforementioned scenario.Let's say you and I are sitting on a bench together, in the quad of a university campus. We both watch a young boy walk up and sign his name on something. We notice he uses his left hand. We're sure of it. So we follow him into his dorm building, and into the bathroom. And, let's say I go along with you because you seem sincere and I too want to carry out God's will. So we follow him to the bathroom. I smash him over the head with a fire extinguisher. He falls down. I give you a knife and tell you to slit his throat while he's down and I run to the door to be a lookout. You cut him open because you're following God's will. Now, you really mean to tell me while he bleeds out that the only thing you'd see wrong with that was that the 7th commandment said not to do that? What I mean is, the same God you believed wrote the 7th commandment had just given you an instruction that superseded the previous one. You don't think you'd feel the slightest bit of internal remorse for taking a kids life? Even if you were doing what you believed God told you to do?

Does God determine what's right?

Or, does God approve of that which is right?

Even more simply put, Is something holy because God deems it so, or does God approve of that which is holy? I'm sure you've probably already considered the answer to this question. But, like I said, I don't have the answers to questions such as these. I must defer to you here. Thank you again for taking the time to discuss this with me. I look forward to hearing your thoughts.

I would have to question God in this case you've invented. But, the scenario you've provided is too unrealistic. I hope I can answer your questions.

You see, if "Faith" in God is at question.... I have unwavering faith (at least in big things)! So, He cannot question me for that.

If "obeying" Him is the point, I am doing so by NOT killing. God is NOT contradictory... at least in my [personal experiences] of Him. And I don't feel an inner conflict about God, in any situation.

If Jesus is indeed "the Way"? I'm right on the money here!

The better scenario, would be; "what God is telling me as I walk by a homeless person freezing, on a sidewalk?"

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It's about God. Not people. "Stupid" is following "religiously" anything man institutes. Our relationship is one on one with our Savior. All else is suspect.

This is not Catholicism. A central tenet of Catholicism is that God is revealed through the hierarchy of the church and only in extremely rare & very special circumstances by personal revelation. Basically, you're not worthy of having a 'one-on-one relationship' with God.

Its time to take the shades off and realize that God is the standard. Unchanging. The rule.

Everything else SUCKS!

You claim to be Catholic so you have to admit to having no one-on-one relationship with God. However you also reject anything instituted by man (e.g. religious structure, hierarchy, the bible etc.). How then do you know what God's standard is and how it hasn't & will not change?

A perfect example of a lack in the Holy Spirit...or Jesus' teachings!

Actually this is laughable! Since when is a personal relationship with God "unworthy" of the Catholic church?

Again, you judge God "using" people as your guide. That's like judging food by the plate its served on! "Stupid"