(February 10, 2014 at 1:12 am)rasetsu Wrote: We do live in a life prohibiting universe.
We don't live in a life prohibiting universe if we're alive. Because multicellular life is complicated it has complex requirements and it will only survive where local conditions allow but there will be plenty of planets like this one out there, life at the microbial level at least could even be very widespread and found just about everywhere. So the fine tuning argument holds up very well else you will with a straight face have to claim that all this complexity arouse by pure chance/blind luck.
Quote:The sad thing is that so many are seduced by the fine-tuning bullshit. Largely because people don't understand probability
This universe/life within it doesn't seem a bit improbable to you? It's as unlikely a thing you could possibly imagine, it just seems normal because you're used to the idea of being alive, you're used to a universe with the requirements that allow you to live.
Quote:, but also partly because, as most often stated, it's simply a lie.
We know we exist and we know the universe is utterly precisely fine tunned to allow for it. This all deserves a good explanation I'd suggest one that has intention/purpose. There is an explanation that would fit, it's an old explanation but it's still good.
Quote: We can't say that the universe is fine-tuned for life.
Well it wouldn't sustain life if anything was even slightly out out of balance in the mechanics of it so that's the fine tuning we notice. It's real enough it just depends on how you would like to account for it. You're saying it was unintentional somehow, hmmmm, well ok, that's sort of remotely possible, seems kind of unlikely but you never know

Quote: It might be narrowly tuned for life as we know it
You could have silicon based life but this would require the same amount of fine tuning as carbon based life so it makes no difference.
Quote:but nobody knows what forms life in the general can take
You can have carbon based life and silicon based life, scientifically we know what could work in potential.
Quote:, so there's no way to honestly assert that we even know what conditions are required for life, plural.
You need planets, you need stars, you need a liquid solvent (water in the case of carbon based life) you need stable conditions over a long period of time. All of this required precise fine tuning.
Quote: As typically stated, it's simply a lie and a misrepresentation.
It's an honest observation of the physical universe as it really is in fact as revealed by science. They made same the argument before modern science and we can make the same argument now fully enhanced by modern science.
Come all ye faithful joyful and triumphant.