Totally NOT a debate about the veracity of the gospels

[DarkHorse]

Because I once believed in it. And I don't know if I can ever get past that part of it. The part where I followed it for a long time, and like you, witnessed my faith to others. And for what? A lie?

It is a lie, discipulus. I know you don't or won't see it that way, but maybe someday ...you will be on the other side, just like I am, now. And while I've come a long way, it's very hard to get past knowing that a religion like Christianity has prospered for so long, by duping people.

This is what I feel, anyways.

Nah, you have just been duped Deidre. Somewhere along the way you became jaded with Christianity. Since you have never been born again or have experienced what it is like to have a personal intimate relationship with Jesus, this is to be expected.

You grew up in a Christian home maybe. You probably went to church often and sang the songs and read the bible and hung out with friends and had the warm fuzzies on several occassions, but you never saw yourself in desperate need of being saved. You never saw yourself as a sinner. So it follows logically that you would never come to the end of yourself and cry out to be saved from eternal separation from God.

Now you have abandoned Christianity and in order to silence the voice of conviction you rail and rant and rave viciously at anyone who speaks the truth. You try to drown that voice of reason that whispers to you in the innermost part of your being by a multiplicity of words and arguments that you yourself know are simply ridiculous.

By your own admission you have not been born from above and therefore you cannot see the kingdom of God.

Those that do hunger and thirst after righteousness will be filled Deidre.

I believe you hunger now. I believe that is why you are here.

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Fine, I'll restate the question for the benefit of an evasive jerkoff.

Do you, disciplus, believe the bible is the infallible word of God, or a fallible work of men?

I believe the Words of God are true and that they endure forever.

It seems to me you enjoy feeling as though you know someone, when in actual fact you don't.

I was a born again Christian once. I was brought up in a Christian home. When I was 16, I went through a very dark time. Actually, my whole life was filled with darkness from the beginning of my life. I wanted it to end by that point. I cried out to God, I needed Him. I was desperate.

Now I see, I dreamed all that up because I needed to believe that he heard me. Everything that happened that I attributed to God, looking back now, it was a) coincidence and b) my own mind. A lot of it, I can see, now that my eyes are open, how I contributed to making those things happen.

Anyway, it carried on for years, I was on a spiritual high. Yes, I went through hard times and times when I was angry with God, but I never fell away. I believed in him through it all, believed he was my savior. I knew as a sinner I needed him. I was invested. Hell, I wanted to become a minister. My dad was one, and I helped with the youth group. So don't tell me I wasn't a true Christian, or I didn't DO IT RIGHT. My deconversion happened slowly, over time. Do you think I wanted that to happen? I became more and more despondent and things made less and less sense. Those things that came up every now and then that I shoved away because I didn't want to deal with it and think that christianity was a lie. Well, now I can see clearly, and I don't see a god that's angry with me, or is going to send me to hell for not believing anymore. I feel at peace.

What right do you have to tell Deidre who she is, or why you THINK she's here? That she doesn't know what you know, so can't possibly have what you have, because of that?

You're probably going to go on a rant about this message and defend yourself and christianity, but I don't give a shit.

Oh and one more thing. If the words of god are true, then why does it take a concordance and whatever other religious material you have, in order to make sense of most of it? That's one thing I never understood. If god wants us to follow him and do his will, then why the hell make it so hard to understand the so called TRUE meaning behind what's written? Think that's a fair god? Hell, if you have a kid and you want him/her to be happy, are you going to make life difficult for him, and talk to them in riddles? Doesn't make sense, sorry.