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Deism
#8
RE: Deism
(June 6, 2014 at 2:17 am)beamo1080 Wrote: So the fact that people still adhere to a belief in god even after separating themselves from religion raises the question: why?

Thanks for asking. I say this because some atheists seem to rush to judgment or do nothing more than glance at the dictionary definition. Richard Dawkins in "The God Delusion" defined deism as "watered down theism" using only a deeply flawed definition from a dictionary as his basis. Those who are familiar with my posts can tell you, what I have in common with the theists is we both use the word "God" (meaning radically different things by the use of the word) and the similarity ends there.

In practice, deism is atheism with poetic flourishes.

How I live my life, evaluate morality, gain a sense of meaning, relate to others, sleep in on Sunday, etc. would not change if I were to ever shift to atheism. At one point in my activism in the Freethought movement, I was the organizer of the Louisville Atheists and Freethinkers. I've always believed in unity among freethinkers of all stripes, including pantheists, agnostics, atheists and some transcendentalists (the ones that aren't into the New Age woo).

For me, deism is a balance between my skeptical mind and sentimental (proverbial) heart. It's a way to have such "spiritual" instincts and yet keep it all grounded in the natural universe. Fortunately, the natural universe is actually more inspiring than anything religion offers. As Dawkins has noted, religions create petty gods.

I remember once coming out of the New York Planetarium with my extended family on Sunday morning. In an impolitic moment on my part, I blurted out the rhetorical question "why would anyone waste their time in a church?" within earshot of my Christian sister (she's the anomaly in our non-religious family). Hitchens once put it more bluntly, asking who's going to look through the Hubble telescope and then go back to the burning bush.

I recognize the logical problems that you discuss with the non-falsifiability of Nature's God. That part of deism is more instinct for me. I observe the universe and I see a grand machine. I reflect on the development of human evolution, including not just the enlarging cranial capacity but all the other things that came together which made our civilization possible, and I see intent.

The instinctive part of deism is probably why, from what I've observed from deists online and their stories they relate to me, so few ever seem to "convert" to deism, at least with any stability. Any time I hear of an ex-Christian or ex-Muslim making such a switch, I can predict they'll identify as "atheist" within a few years. Deism is usually just a way-station in their deconversion from religion. The cold, uncaring Nature's God must seem like a poor substitute for the loving security blanket that Jesus represents. As with Honey Badger, Nature's God don't give a shit.

Those who identify as deists and remain so relate the same story that was my experience. As with my sexual orientation, I didn't change. I discovered that's what I've been all along. Prior, I'd identified as "agnostic". Coincidentally, I made both self-discoveries around the same time in my life, not that I think they have anything to do with one another.

At one point, the truce between my skeptical and sentimental sides was uneasy. I went through a two week period where I wondered what was wrong with me, why I couldn't be a normal atheist like most of my friends and family. I came to terms that the difference is instinctive, as I elaborated above, and have so come to terms with my dual nature.

Btw, I put "spiritual" above in quotes because I don't actually believe in an afterlife. One might exist for all I know but I have trouble wrapping my mind around the idea of consciousness without a brain. I still use the term "spirit" as a metaphor for the very real process of self-awareness and experience in the natural universe. By "spiritual" I mean more emotional well-being, desire to grow and general awe of the natural universe. Like Sam Harris, I think religion has claimed a monopoly on matters that can be explored and utilized without the woo.

Oddly enough, my wife is an atheist who believes in ghosts, sort of my mirror opposite, so that shows there are all kinds in the freethought camp.

I have offered some arguments for deism over atheism, namely my "homosexuality proves God" line. Atheists find it completely unconvincing but it does have the advantage of being a deist argument that Christians aren't likely to hijack any time soon.

Hope this helps. I'll gladly answer any follow up questions.
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Messages In This Thread
Deism - by beamo1080 - June 6, 2014 at 2:17 am
RE: Deism - by Minimalist - June 6, 2014 at 2:25 am
RE: Deism - by beamo1080 - June 6, 2014 at 2:35 am
Deism - by Rampant.A.I. - June 6, 2014 at 2:48 am
RE: Deism - by Napoléon - June 6, 2014 at 8:56 am
RE: Deism - by JesusHChrist - June 6, 2014 at 9:56 am
RE: Deism - by ThePinsir - June 6, 2014 at 10:30 am
RE: Deism - by DeistPaladin - June 6, 2014 at 10:31 am
RE: Deism - by beamo1080 - June 6, 2014 at 11:42 am
RE: Deism - by DeistPaladin - June 6, 2014 at 1:20 pm
RE: Deism - by Napoléon - June 6, 2014 at 1:22 pm
RE: Deism - by DeistPaladin - June 6, 2014 at 1:31 pm
RE: Deism - by Napoléon - June 6, 2014 at 1:38 pm
RE: Deism - by DeistPaladin - June 7, 2014 at 1:38 am
RE: Deism - by Minimalist - June 6, 2014 at 1:32 pm
RE: Deism - by DeistPaladin - June 6, 2014 at 2:13 pm
RE: Deism - by Confused Ape - June 6, 2014 at 3:19 pm
RE: Deism - by Brian37 - June 6, 2014 at 2:10 pm
RE: Deism - by JesusHChrist - June 6, 2014 at 2:20 pm
RE: Deism - by Brian37 - June 6, 2014 at 2:30 pm
RE: Deism - by JesusHChrist - June 6, 2014 at 3:29 pm
RE: Deism - by Brian37 - June 7, 2014 at 9:52 am
RE: Deism - by beamo1080 - June 6, 2014 at 2:25 pm
Deism - by Rampant.A.I. - June 7, 2014 at 12:17 am
Deism - by Rampant.A.I. - June 7, 2014 at 2:57 am
RE: Deism - by Napoléon - June 7, 2014 at 10:19 am
RE: Deism - by Brian37 - June 7, 2014 at 11:22 am
RE: Deism - by Autumnlicious - June 7, 2014 at 1:37 pm



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