what are we supposed to say again when christians ask us where we get our morality?

[GrandizerII]

I pick two sticks from here and two sticks from there, and they add up to 4. That's nature telling me 2 + 2 = 4 ...

Right, and that's exactly how the sort of morality I'm talking about arrives at a conclusion.

Sure, we come up with the symbols and concepts, but at least nature actually shows us the answer directly anyway. Unlike with morality where you have to make the judgement yourself. Nature only shows you whether an act leads to this or that consequence, and you have to judge what this means for you based on your criteria.

I don't have to make any judgement other than whether or not nature shows me acceptable criteria for right, or wrong. We -all- have to judge what -everything- means based upon our criteria, what's the alternative. This would be an extremely pedantic point to make. I'm not exactly expecting nature to fucking text me bro.

Nature doesn't set criteria. We set them ourselves. And then, based on these criteria, nature shows you whether or not an act fulfills the criteria or not.

With 2 + 2 = 4, or 1 + 2 =3, or earth being round, our observations of nature itself directly shows us the answer. We come up with the right language to describe what nature shows us, sure, but nature itself shows the answer without us having to come up with arbitrary criteria in order to be able to make some judgement.

I don't judge that 2 + 2 = 4 and that the earth must be round. I observe that 2 + 2= 4 and that the earth is round (based on what the photographs of Earth show me).

I guess what I'm trying to say is our sensory input data are derived from nature itself when it comes to various mathematical/logical/scientific questions and then we process it in our minds. But when it comes to morality, we spread out the input we choose and then see what answer nature provides us with according to the input we set forth and then we make the proper judgement based on the answer provided.