(July 30, 2014 at 10:44 pm)MPCADF Wrote: For me it is really simply why I don't believe in atheism, because the universe can't come from nothing, that is, non-existence,Funny thing is that most scientists don't say that universe came from nothing. Its mostly christian that say that when they are building a straw man. I personally am happy too say I don't know because I'm quite happy that I was born in a time where we still have some puzzles left.
Quote: because that which does not exist can't cause anything, since it doesn't exist. We only have evidence of causation from 'something', no evidence to the contrary.Actually there is a entire field of physics that is devoted to studying things that randomly pop into existance from nothing. It's called quantum physics.
Quote:And I don't believe in atheism because the universe(s) could not have always existed because if it (they) had then by definition there would have been an be an infinite regress of cause and effects,This may be a little hard to get your head around but, all if the laws of science started at one planck time after the big bang including time as we know it. So the singularity it self was not subject too time as we would know, or it could have been in a timeless state. So given what we know yes the universe could have "always existed" with a infinite regress.
Quote:so you would have had an eternity to come into being before now, so you should have already happened. And self-contradictorily, you would never have existed because a past eternity would continue to go on for eternity, thus never reaching this point of existence now.One issue with this. We know from how god behaves in the bible that his action are sequential and often reactionary. We also know from both jesus and the angel in revelation that god waits. That means that he too is subject to time and you get the same issue you listed off above.
Quote:Then how do you avoid the infinite regress?
Therefore, by this evidential reasoning, I conclude nature needs a cause outside of itself, outside of time and space, being uncreated.
Quote: This uncreated Creator is Whom I call God. Logical, since we know the uncreated Creator exist, it is incumbent upon us to find out where God reveals Himself personally. The initial caveat is that God is not self-contradictory so only one religion can be the correct one.Why would such a being be obliged to reveal himself at all? The universe is 13 billion light across with trillions of sunlike stars and more planets then there grains of sand on every beach on earth put together. I would not be surprised with such a being was not even aware of our existence and I would be wholly surprised if it gave a fuck where I stuck my peepee.
To-morrow, and to-morrow, and to-morrow,
Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
To the last syllable of recorded time;
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player,
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage,
And then is heard no more. It is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.
Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
To the last syllable of recorded time;
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player,
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage,
And then is heard no more. It is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.
