On the nature of evidence.

[trmof]

Yes, that is an attempt to say something nice to someone I am clearly not going to convince and would like to leave with a kind word. What is your specific problem with that?

My problem is that you should be able to anticipate that talking about Sky Daddy to a confirmed atheist will be received about as warmly as you kindly telling him his daughter is a hot piece of ass.

But let's get back to evidence. This thread is about what evidence a non-Christian would accept for the existence of God. But that's condescending-- it implies that the Christian already has good reason to believe in God, and the atheist doesn't "get" it-- a proverbial doubting Thomas. The real question is this-- what evidence do YOU have that has caused you to believe that God is real, rather than a cultural fiction fed to you by your parents or peers? Why should anyone outside your culture adopt your ideas about reality?

Let's stop goofing around with the burden of proof. Most of the atheists here are atheists simply because they feel there's no compelling reason to hold to, and act on, a God idea. If you want them to change their mind, then go ahead and give them a good reason. But don't be surprised if you have to get in line-- the hindus, buddhists, muslims, Zoroastrians, Satanists, pagans, and dog-talking serial killers also have their own fantasies that they want others to adopt. And they're all saying the same thing: "You can't PROVE that reality is what it seems to be, so Krshna, Gotama, Zoroaster, Beelzebub, Zeus, Rover."

That is a universally unlikable reaction to have to things that you disagree with, and it should make the one who has it question why they are so sensitive about the subject. If you think it is normal or expected you should rethink that presumption, as this is not a common reaction and will do nothing to endear you to others, or to sway their opinions . I prefer to treat people with respect until they have treated me otherwise several times. It's a very endearing social skill to have.

As for my personal testimony, I plan on posting that at some point in the near future in another part of the forum. Feel free to dissect it there.

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It's not a healthy personality trait to be unable to simply agree to disagree with somebody in a cordial manner. However, this is based simply on my personal experiences and intuition, so I don't expect it to sway you at all.

It's far more unhealthy to confuse a disagreement of opinion with an inability to determine fact from fantasy. Fortunately, it can be cured.

This is nothing but your intuition on healthy social conduct. You have already stated that personal intuition is not a reliable indicator of reality, therefore I will apply your own standard to this statement and discount it as false and irrelevant on it's face.