Systematically Dismantling Atheism

[Brian37]

Benny, note the jump in subject from your responses 1 and 2, to response number 3. The first two address belief, the third addresses knowledge claims. They aren't the same thing.

There are only two responses to the question "Do you believe in God", and those are
1) Yes, I affirmatively believe in god.
2) Anything else that is not an affirmative belief in god.

Even if you say "I don't know if I believe in god" (which would be strange, as it would imply you don't know what's going on in your own head), you would still be in category 2, i.e. not having an affirmative belief.

A/gnosticism is about the claim to knowledge, whether or not you know god exists or claim it as an epistemological truth. It isn't a confidence rating, it just a claim to either not know for sure (agnosticism) or to claim to know for sure (gnosticism).

It's not strange at all not to be able to resolve a question into a single answer, and many reasons why "I don't know" doesn't imply your assessment of your knowledge about something. For example, if I ask you "Do you think 'x' is true?" You could answer that you don't believe in 'x'. But you could also say, "Until you tell me what 'x' means, then I don't know whether I have a belief that represents it or not." I wouldn't say I default to a-xism because I'm incapable of forming an active belief.

So if you DEFINE God, I'm very likely to say that I'm either an agnostic theist or a gnostic theist. "God is Sky Daddy." Nope. "God is the subjective spark which makes us more than machines." Weird, but yep.

If you cannot adequately define God, then my position is: "wtf you talkin' about, Linus?"

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I am giving you a BETTER definition.

Great. Define "better" while you're at it.

Are you CURRENTLY agnostic about unicorns? You would still have to admit since you have not lived the future that "technically" you have to be "agnostic" since we cannot no with 100% certainty.

I'm an agnostic a-unicornist, because my mind can resolve that question down to a single answer-- no, I don't believe unicorns are real, and in fact I believe they are false. The agnosticism isn't about unicorns-- it's about my confidence in my disbelief in unicorns.

So the term agnostic atheist is not contradictory.

No, it's not contradictory, and it probably desribes 90% of atheists.

Now Huxley took a Greek prefix and a Greek suffix that were never used in ancient Greece together. But when you properly use them individually separately this is how they are defined.

Prefix "a"=without

Suffix="gnosis or gnostic"=knowledge.

NETHER that prefix or suffix say anything about subject matter or position. So the word has to be put in front of something for it to make sense.

Answers are partially defined by the context in which they are given. If someone is unable to answer a question, or even to establish a leaning toward an answer, then agnosticism is itself a viable position.

Next time you are out in public, walk up to a complete stranger and say "I dont know", don't say anything else. I would bet my life they are going to say "You don't know what?" The simply repeat "I don't know". Keep repeating that and nothing else until they walk away from you because they think you are nuts.

That is why I say "I don't know" is not a position. It has to go in front of something to make sense.

Okay, let's try this. Is there a boobledyboo on my desk? Hint-- boobledyboo is a common household object.

Are you going to claim that you're an agnostic a-boobledybooist?

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There are gnostics and agnostics on either side.

So the extreme left/right position, in lack of a better word, would be "I know, god exists" and "I know, god doesn't exist".

I call myself an agnostic atheist, but I'm tending more to gnostic atheism when it comes to the biblical god.

And what if someone is neither theist nor atheist, but is agnostic?

Holy crap, have you not read my prior posts. The moron who invented that word long ago cobbled it together to make a horrible word that has infected people with bad use of logic. The Greeks never had a word for "inbetween". Huxley invented that bullshit word and it has been infecting human logic ever since. Here is the original meaning of the prefix and suffix that NEVER were put together by the Greeks.

Greek prefix "a"=without
Greek suffix "gnosis,"

agnostic=without knowledge. Which is NOT a word the ancient Greeks actually used. Huxley invented that stupid word centuries later.

Now if you think that is a position by itself. Next time you are out in public walk up to a complete stranger and say "I don't know", don't say anything else, just "I don't know". They are going to look at you and say "what is it you don't know about". The just say again "I don't know", then they will look at you and ask again, or walk away because they think you are nuts. Now here are some better definitions IF IF IF people still insist on using that word, lets use that invented word PROPERLY in context of past present and future.

If you think a god exists CURRENTLY, but or not sure what to call it or what it is made of, and are open to a future that you are unsure of,

Then you are an agnostic theist.

If you are sure CURRENTLY that you have the right god, and are certain in the future no one will prove that wrong, then you are

A theist, like a Christian, or Muslim, or Jew, Or Mormon or Muslim

If you CURRENTLY hold no belief in a god and your CURRENT position is "off" , but are unsure about the future,

Then you are an agnostic atheist.

If you are CURRENTLY in the "off" position but SURE about the future that there will never be a god filling the gaps,

Then you are a flat out atheist.

Now for me personally, I only call my self an "agnostic" atheist in a very semantic sense for "technical" reasons that "technically" I have not lived my future yet. But even with that "technicality" unless I suffer some brain injury or illness, or PTSD, with what I am armed with, and baring a scientific discovery of a god, I do not see myself changing my position in my lucid state.

My current position is "off", my glass is empty in holding the position of a god. I am only "technically" agnostic about the future because I have not lived it yet.

That puts the word "agnostic" in a more proper context as per the meaning of the Greek prefix and suffix. Huxley did not add in the other factors of time frame on top of "I dont know" is not a position itself.