Detecting design or intent in nature

[BlackMason]

Good to know.

Now let's be clear here. I'm not suggesting nature is actually designed. I just don't think that you have come up with proof that it isn't.

I was presenting an argument not proof.

Of course the extinction of the dodo didn't do the dodo any good. But that doesn't mean the dodo wasn't designed.

Not all prototypes lead to final products. And sometimes, you try an thing and it doesn't work, so you stop production. Sometimes, a perfectly useful thing is superseded by a better thing or even just something we prefer. We currently prefer CD's and MP3s to 8 Tracks. That doesn't do the 8 Tracks any good, but it doesn't mean we didn't design them.

I see the problem. You've confused my argument. I'm arguing that nature has no goals as per my syllogism. I'm not talking design here.

I'm not sure anything came out of the dodos, but many modern animals do have extinct ancestors who could be thought of as a waste products.

No I disagree. We have a common ancestor with chimpanzees and other apes. If chimpanzees were to become extinct tomorrow can we say they were our waste product or we theirs?

You are arguing that nature is not designed because there are extinct species. And I am saying that when people design things, we do create things which we later abandon. Therefore abandoned things in nature aren't proof that there was no designer of nature, only that if there is a designer, it sometimes abandons things.

No that's not my argument. Teleology =/= design