RE: Detecting design or intent in nature
February 13, 2015 at 8:50 pm
(This post was last modified: February 13, 2015 at 9:02 pm by Heywood.)
(February 13, 2015 at 5:45 pm)Mr.wizard Wrote:(February 13, 2015 at 5:29 pm)Heywood Wrote: You really need to read this thread because all your question have been asked and answered several times. The question isn't whether or not intellect is actively guiding biological evolution. The question is do such systems come into existence sans intellect. Observations suggest that such systems do not come into existence sans intellect.
Can you present an observation of a such a system coming into existence sans intellect?
I don't have to read it, observations suggest no such thing. You are simply asserting an intelligence, giving it credit for certain things, and then saying well you cant prove that intelligence didn't do it. You say you have observed this process, well where is this intelligence? Who is it? How does it work?
Answered several times already in the thread. After 108 pages I no longer have the patience to rehash again what has already been hashed multiple upon multiple times over. I suggest you start looking for systems which contain replication, heritable traits, change, and selection. You can find these if you look for them. See if you can find any of these that you can definitively say have come into existence without intellect. You can find plenty that definitively have come into existence requiring intellect. You can find none that don't.
(February 13, 2015 at 8:16 pm)Esquilax Wrote: Wow, is this thread still going? I would have thought that after i showed that heywood's argument was self refuting, he'd stop using it.
Sorry Esquilax, if it makes you feel better about yourself to believe that you have shown my argument to be self refuting, go for it. Your mental well being is more important than this thread.
(February 13, 2015 at 8:18 pm)bennyboy Wrote: Still cherry picking, I see. The question is whether such systems come into existence sans Earth-based, evolved organic life forms. Observations suggest that such systems do not come into existence sans Earth-based, evolved organic life forms.
That you are clearly trying to equivocate between human intelligence and that of God is a pretty sad testiment for the existence of an Almighty Creator, dude. I mean. . . reaching much?
Benny, when I ask you guys for an example that refutes my conclusion, I am not cherry picking just because you can't come up with any that falsify my conclusion.
I'll examine everything you guys present. First I will determine if it contains the elements of replication, heritiable traits, change, and selection. Then I will determine if was observed requiring intellect to come into existence or if it was observed coming into existence without intellect.
If the example you guys ever get around to presenting is observed coming into existence without intellect, and contains replication, heritiable traits, change, and selection, I'll have to concede.
Its really that simple. You guys should not be dodging and obsfuscating for 108 pages when if your atheistic faith is correct, observations of these systems coming into existence sans intellect should be readily available.
