RE: Eternal the originator of time - proof.
April 11, 2015 at 8:34 pm
(This post was last modified: April 11, 2015 at 9:32 pm by Mystic.)
Quote:What you have done is said "Existence represents an infinite regression, which is paradoxical. Therefore, we need a philosophical quantity, X, which solves this paradox."
The problem is that you insist X must be separate from whatever exists. However, there is now a new system: "whatever exists + X," and you anyway need to explain how this new system originated.
X being separate from whatever exists is obvious, as it originated all things in time through it's power and will. It is eternal, while everything in time is not eternal, and it brought into being, it being the original definition of true existence, the whole universe depends on it's existence and power to exist.
Quote: You will need an infinite regression of Gods.That doesn't follow, and is in fact illogical to assume.
Quote:[quote pid='918201' dateline='1428798594']
You don't get to break the rules of logic simply by claiming that something must exist which is illogical. If so, then your idea is itself illogical.
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How is an eternal creator illogical?
(April 11, 2015 at 8:32 pm)robvalue Wrote: If the creator needs no cause, then not everything needs a cause, so we can't say the universe needs a cause without extra justification.I presented that extra justification. So please address it instead of the usual kalam argument you are use to.
The whole of time is not eternal (ie. present, some of the past is not eternal)
No point of time existed eternally (fact, a point of time passes from another point of time)
It's hence illogical to state time is eternal when none of it is eternal, and the past present and future didn't always exist either. To say time always existed is hence refuted as is saying a point of time always existed, and would be attacking the conclusion instead of the argument.
The logical conclusion is that it has beginning.
To state the beginning of time is without cause is saying it just appeared out of nothing into existence without cause which is irrational.
Thus time has a cause.
The cause must before time and eternal. It being eternal needs no cause.
It originating time and creating shows it has incredible power and a will.
I also thought of adding the following argument:
1. A time always has time preceding it except for perhaps the start of time.
2. If there is no start of time, each point of time would be preceded by another point of time.
3. If there is no start of time, no point of time can come into being without a time preceding.
4. If there there is no start of time, every point of time needs time preceding.
5. The whole of time is every point of time.
6. There would be no time preceding the whole of time where it had no beginning.
7. Thus it's a paradox showing time indeed has a start from an eternal being.