RE: Atheism vs. the Quran
September 6, 2013 at 5:07 pm
(This post was last modified: September 6, 2013 at 5:16 pm by paulpablo.)
Before I even start the beginning of the argument I'd like the begin with the arguments against the quran which I just find idiotic which won't be featured in my arguments.
Muhammad was a pedo so Islam is wrong.--- Not all muslims agree muhammad slept with a 9 year old, the ones that do will just tell you sleeping with a 9 year old is fine anyway, I disagree with this but I don't claim to know for any certainty what is right or wrong for the entire world I just know what I think the laws should be, this is really no argument against god in any case.
Terrorists are bad so all of Islam is bad.---- I do think that terrorism is something that certainly crops up among a lot of muslims, but it crops a lot within most groups of organized people. Some of my argument will probably include things about terrorism but it isn't a clear argument against the quran or gods existence.
I know some muslims and they beat their wives so Islam is wrong.--- Again this isn't all Muslims so it's pointless to pick on a few individuals.
I heard of a hadith that said Muhammad actually could read and therefore wasn't illiterate--- I don't see any reason to put 100 percent trust in any of the so called authentic hadiths or unauthentic it doesn't matter either way to me.
BEGINNING
Ok to begin with before I even touch the topic of what I think of the quran itself or muslims or islam the best first question to ask is why should the cult of muhammad be taken any more seriously than any other cult ? As in why even bother to open a quran, start a debate. Why should anyone even consider that this might not be the same as every single other cult that claims to have a prophet, miracles, the message of god and so on?
Should I begin to study the quran because the religion of Islam has a lot of followers and converts so there must be something to it?
No.
Not all muslims convert to the same type of Islam, there's the nation of Islam, sunni islam, shia islam, quranist muslims and others I think. In fact I'd go as far to say as it's very difficult to find two muslims who both believe the quran is telling them the exact same thing.
There's plenty of people who believe in the church of mormon, and the christian bible it doesn't make it any more real.
Should I study the quran because the quran gives scientific knowledge which was undiscovered at the time muhammad recited the quran?
I haven't read all the quran and I doubt I have heard all the claims of scientific miracles within the quran yet but I've heard a lot and I haven't been convinced by a single one yet.
They range from the absurd ones I've heard such as "The quran predicted radar technology" To ones that admittedly seemed plausible at first but after more thought and research were debunked.
Besides think about it, I go to heaven and tell god I didn't believe in the cult of muhammad because I thought it was like every other cult and can you imagine him saying to me
"If you were skeptical then you should have just researched the quran, learned arabic, then researched about the oceans and how the part of the quran says there's a barrier between salt water and fresh water, and then realized its true"
Should I study the quran because the people, cultures, countries and followers of the religion of Islam and of the quran are exemplary people, more educated, more peaceful, healthier, longer lifespans and with higher standards of technology?
No.
No explanation with this one really needed I think but just a simple no.
Should I bother to open and read a quran because the quran hasn't been changed since it was first written unlike the bible and other scripture.
No.
I don't know for sure if this is true, it's been debated by people much more knowledgeable about it than me.
When I was in college my friend wrote in ink in big block capital letters on a brick in a wall behind the college "FAT WHORE OF SATAN"
That was over ten years ago and it's still there, a lot of the papers we wrote our notes on is probably long gone by now yet this "FAT WHORE OF SATAN" is still there, unchanged, doesn't make it any more true or believable.
Things being unchanged don't impress me, I don't understand the big deal about this.
This is pretty much the end of the beginning focusing on the question why should anyone even begin to take any of the claims seriously over any other cult.
The next part will be about what I have gathered after I have bothered to open the quran out of interest, some objections I have to it being the word of the god. Or should I say the word of god passed through an angel, recited to muhammad, who recited it to other people who could write.
And why it seems to me to look like a man made cult.
Muhammad was a pedo so Islam is wrong.--- Not all muslims agree muhammad slept with a 9 year old, the ones that do will just tell you sleeping with a 9 year old is fine anyway, I disagree with this but I don't claim to know for any certainty what is right or wrong for the entire world I just know what I think the laws should be, this is really no argument against god in any case.
Terrorists are bad so all of Islam is bad.---- I do think that terrorism is something that certainly crops up among a lot of muslims, but it crops a lot within most groups of organized people. Some of my argument will probably include things about terrorism but it isn't a clear argument against the quran or gods existence.
I know some muslims and they beat their wives so Islam is wrong.--- Again this isn't all Muslims so it's pointless to pick on a few individuals.
I heard of a hadith that said Muhammad actually could read and therefore wasn't illiterate--- I don't see any reason to put 100 percent trust in any of the so called authentic hadiths or unauthentic it doesn't matter either way to me.
BEGINNING
Ok to begin with before I even touch the topic of what I think of the quran itself or muslims or islam the best first question to ask is why should the cult of muhammad be taken any more seriously than any other cult ? As in why even bother to open a quran, start a debate. Why should anyone even consider that this might not be the same as every single other cult that claims to have a prophet, miracles, the message of god and so on?
Should I begin to study the quran because the religion of Islam has a lot of followers and converts so there must be something to it?
No.
Not all muslims convert to the same type of Islam, there's the nation of Islam, sunni islam, shia islam, quranist muslims and others I think. In fact I'd go as far to say as it's very difficult to find two muslims who both believe the quran is telling them the exact same thing.
There's plenty of people who believe in the church of mormon, and the christian bible it doesn't make it any more real.
Should I study the quran because the quran gives scientific knowledge which was undiscovered at the time muhammad recited the quran?
I haven't read all the quran and I doubt I have heard all the claims of scientific miracles within the quran yet but I've heard a lot and I haven't been convinced by a single one yet.
They range from the absurd ones I've heard such as "The quran predicted radar technology" To ones that admittedly seemed plausible at first but after more thought and research were debunked.
Besides think about it, I go to heaven and tell god I didn't believe in the cult of muhammad because I thought it was like every other cult and can you imagine him saying to me
"If you were skeptical then you should have just researched the quran, learned arabic, then researched about the oceans and how the part of the quran says there's a barrier between salt water and fresh water, and then realized its true"
Should I study the quran because the people, cultures, countries and followers of the religion of Islam and of the quran are exemplary people, more educated, more peaceful, healthier, longer lifespans and with higher standards of technology?
No.
No explanation with this one really needed I think but just a simple no.
Should I bother to open and read a quran because the quran hasn't been changed since it was first written unlike the bible and other scripture.
No.
I don't know for sure if this is true, it's been debated by people much more knowledgeable about it than me.
When I was in college my friend wrote in ink in big block capital letters on a brick in a wall behind the college "FAT WHORE OF SATAN"
That was over ten years ago and it's still there, a lot of the papers we wrote our notes on is probably long gone by now yet this "FAT WHORE OF SATAN" is still there, unchanged, doesn't make it any more true or believable.
Things being unchanged don't impress me, I don't understand the big deal about this.
This is pretty much the end of the beginning focusing on the question why should anyone even begin to take any of the claims seriously over any other cult.
The next part will be about what I have gathered after I have bothered to open the quran out of interest, some objections I have to it being the word of the god. Or should I say the word of god passed through an angel, recited to muhammad, who recited it to other people who could write.
And why it seems to me to look like a man made cult.
Are you ready for the fire? We are firemen. WE ARE FIREMEN! The heat doesn’t bother us. We live in the heat. We train in the heat. It tells us that we’re ready, we’re at home, we’re where we’re supposed to be. Flames don’t intimidate us. What do we do? We control the flame. We control them. We move the flames where we want to. And then we extinguish them.
Impersonation is treason.
