RE: Was the condemnation of man justified?
December 9, 2020 at 9:35 am
(This post was last modified: December 9, 2020 at 10:02 am by The Grand Nudger.)
Facts about another person may be a well ordered series of proximate causes and their effects, real or imagined. He pissed me off, so I hit him. He makes me happy, so I gave him all the kingdoms of the world. I couldn't change him, so I killed the better man. These may be facts. Their relevance to the moral fact of the matter, however, can be expressed as;
He pissed me off, so I hit him -and it was a moral act
He pissed me off, so I hit him -and it was an immoral act.
The facts as stated, the effect that people can have - and the action taken by the agent, are ambiguous. We would have to inquire about other facts to comment on the moral nature of the agent or whether the second (or third) party deserved what he got. Simply put, nothing about us being bad can certify another moral agent's status. We could both be the bad guys in a given scenario. Nothing about us being good certifies that we deserve whatever another agent has given us. As a point of theological fact, christians maintain that we are not getting what we deserve when god rewards us or when god saves us, whether we're (comparatively) good or bad. Nothing about our depravity rubber stamps a plan to kill the other guy. He and we may both be the bad guys, and it may be that neither of us is getting what we deserve.
Supposing that we do need redemption, and that god does redeem in the manner described - then we have an immoral agent referencing irrelevant facts of a second party in service of their murderous scheme to abrogate moral responsibility by killing a third.
-and because I love to ramble about this shit....
Yes, it's silly, very silly - but it's understandable. Especially placed in the context of how the authors of the myth saw the world and man. Cursed by a god having found them naked in the bushes knowing their nakedness. Lying and hiding of shame. Consigned to a life of toil and service and pain and labor. Subject to sin, and to death.
That's how things are*. How should things be, though? Maybe it would be better if people got better than they deserved. Maybe a loving god has a plan for us to escape this curse. Maybe a deal can be made. Laying aside any reservations about these specific claims..what we see is the expression of hope. A very human thing. The people who came up with the myth didn't live it out. They were post diaspora clerks seeking to return to a golden age myth of the late bronze and early iron age, and expressing that desire for how things should be in their religious traditions by reference to an even more ancient and more mythical past - the initiating circumstance of their then-present predicament. Christians would expand on this theme, enfranchising a greater number of more diverse people into the people of god, and under gods grace.
He pissed me off, so I hit him -and it was a moral act
He pissed me off, so I hit him -and it was an immoral act.
The facts as stated, the effect that people can have - and the action taken by the agent, are ambiguous. We would have to inquire about other facts to comment on the moral nature of the agent or whether the second (or third) party deserved what he got. Simply put, nothing about us being bad can certify another moral agent's status. We could both be the bad guys in a given scenario. Nothing about us being good certifies that we deserve whatever another agent has given us. As a point of theological fact, christians maintain that we are not getting what we deserve when god rewards us or when god saves us, whether we're (comparatively) good or bad. Nothing about our depravity rubber stamps a plan to kill the other guy. He and we may both be the bad guys, and it may be that neither of us is getting what we deserve.
Supposing that we do need redemption, and that god does redeem in the manner described - then we have an immoral agent referencing irrelevant facts of a second party in service of their murderous scheme to abrogate moral responsibility by killing a third.
-and because I love to ramble about this shit....
Yes, it's silly, very silly - but it's understandable. Especially placed in the context of how the authors of the myth saw the world and man. Cursed by a god having found them naked in the bushes knowing their nakedness. Lying and hiding of shame. Consigned to a life of toil and service and pain and labor. Subject to sin, and to death.
That's how things are*. How should things be, though? Maybe it would be better if people got better than they deserved. Maybe a loving god has a plan for us to escape this curse. Maybe a deal can be made. Laying aside any reservations about these specific claims..what we see is the expression of hope. A very human thing. The people who came up with the myth didn't live it out. They were post diaspora clerks seeking to return to a golden age myth of the late bronze and early iron age, and expressing that desire for how things should be in their religious traditions by reference to an even more ancient and more mythical past - the initiating circumstance of their then-present predicament. Christians would expand on this theme, enfranchising a greater number of more diverse people into the people of god, and under gods grace.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
