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Skeptics I no longer have any respect for.
RE: Skeptics I no longer have any respect for.
I think her reddit post was just a gross over-reaction to actions she misunderstood. There's a difference between a true rapist and sincere rape threats, to innocuous jokes that aren't meant to cause any harm, and are intended to be humorous; and she, I think, thinks that they are true threats of rape, which don't acknowledge the fact that they are just comments for the sake of humour which don't involve any malicious intentions.
You could say that you shouldn't say it then, because people might take it the wrong way by not recognizing that they aren't rape threats, but are merely attracted towards her. But then people who do understand it, will know it's a harmless joke, which was intentionally meant to be humorous.
She looks upon them as true threats of rape, and I know for certain that not every girl would react in the manner she did. I see this sort of thing all the time, and no-one takes it this seriously. But PZ Myers and most of them on Pharyngula do admit to this view.
I think Watson needs to start seriously listening to Holmes, to clear the shit from the fan. And there seems to be tonnes of shit on Watson's fan.

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RE: Skeptics I no longer have any respect for.
No, she looks upon them as ways men denigrate the female sex, because no woman says those things about men and therefore men never have to worry about assault or rape.
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RE: Skeptics I no longer have any respect for.



The criticisms are on philosophy, not science. Although if you know of some seriously scientific inaccuracies, please share, I didn't spot any, but none of it was my specialty, but regardless, its a body of work comprising of many different criticisms, separately independent. Some of it may be inaccurate, certainly doesn't invalidate the whole book.

Philosophy is not Data, and the bible is stated to be the Word of God, a perfect being. That is why the bible cannot be in error, because the concept of God cannot be in error.

Last time I checked, Dawkins was still human, and therefore his text is allowed to be fallible.
I doubt you are proposing a point of view that any book which consists an inaccuracy is therefore null and void. My point is that there is much in that book which is valuable as an introduction to atheistic arguments, and it does THAT pretty well.

That is my sole contention. Was it always accurate? I said no, and you say no, our difference on this matter appears to be whether it renders a person as not worthy of respect.

I personally think it fallacious to disregard a body of work based upon a single inaccuracy unless that inaccuracy is the basis for all other derivative statements (or whether the body claims to be the work of a being incapable of error).




I think perhaps, there is a difference for respect for his body of work, and respect for personal actions.
I suspect I don't know the whole story, so I happily concede this point on personal respect.

I do have concerns that personal respect and professional respect should remain separate and clarified when stating a lack of respect for someone. A lack of respect for them, or their views, or both.. its seems an important distinction.

When I say I have respect for a skeptic, its based upon how they conduct that skepticism publicly and their contribution to skeptical argument.
For that reason I respect Dawkins, but as I said in my original response, I don't care for his personality at times (and then he makes me laugh at other times).
Self-authenticating private evidence is useless, because it is indistinguishable from the illusion of it. ― Kel, Kelosophy Blog

If you’re going to watch tele, you should watch Scooby Doo. That show was so cool because every time there’s a church with a ghoul, or a ghost in a school. They looked beneath the mask and what was inside?
The f**king janitor or the dude who runs the waterslide. Throughout history every mystery. Ever solved has turned out to be. Not Magic.
― Tim Minchin, Storm
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RE: Skeptics I no longer have any respect for.
The question then arises, why on Earth would you call a book "The God Delusion" and bring up science? Science has nothing to do with the question of whether God exists; that is a philosophical question.
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RE: Skeptics I no longer have any respect for.
I'm glad to see this kind of thread rather than the mindless praising of high profile atheists simply because they're "one of us". I used to greatly respect the opinions of Dawkins, Hitchens, etc, which I no longer do when it comes to matters of philosophy or theology. The reason I used to respect their opinions was because I knew nothing about religion or philosophy at the time. Dawkin's view on agnosticism (at the time of The God Delusion), for example, was extremely flawed. This doesn't invalidate his other points of course - each point should stand on its own merits. The thing is this was a BIG chapter one error. Definition of terms should be cleared up before you even -start- writing. A lot of atheists fail to dig deeper than Dawkins or Hitchens and thus end up perpetuating the same mistakes they made. Don't get me wrong - I like the guys, but they're not who you go to when you want to learn about philosophy or religion.

The people that really helped me to inform myself were the atheist Youtube community. After a lot of reading and listening I found the best users on Youtube (regarding skepticism, reason, etc) to be: TheraminTrees, QualiaSoup and Evid3nc3. All three have very lucid and accessible videos. Also, TrustingDoubt recently did an interesting series titled "God's Emotions" which I would recommend - despite realising how absurd the Christian god was for a long time I'd never thought of her observations before. ContraPoints is another cool user although his videos often don't relate specifically to religion.

Popular atheist channels on Youtube I'm no longer fond of are Thunderf00t, Pat Condell and TheAmazingAtheist.
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RE: Skeptics I no longer have any respect for.
Tempus, I do like TheAmazingAtheist - I think his videos are great, but I have gone off Thunderf00t and I've never really watched Pat Condell.
I've gotta say though that it was Thunderf00t who actually made me come off the fence, with his creationist videos.
You should try Coughlan616, he is quite hilarious. You know, the guy Thunderf00t diagnosed online as mentally unstable.

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RE: Skeptics I no longer have any respect for.
Coughlan is brilliant.
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RE: Skeptics I no longer have any respect for.
(February 16, 2012 at 2:27 pm)JollyForr Wrote: Tempus, I do like TheAmazingAtheist - I think his videos are great, but I have gone off Thunderf00t and I've never really watched Pat Condell.
I've gotta say though that it was Thunderf00t who actually made me come off the fence, with his creationist videos.
You should try Coughlan616, he is quite hilarious. You know, the guy Thunderf00t diagnosed online as mentally unstable.

I'm familiar with Coughlan616, I'm subbed to him. Part of the reason I stopped watching TheAmazingAtheist recently was because of the rape related comments he made on Reddit. I won't pretend I'm morally outraged by them because I'm not, however, it was a very stupid thing to say. I realise he acknowledged this, but it's just not some slip of the tongue easily made. I mean, I fail to see how anyone moderately intelligent could get into a debate (or a fight, rather) on the internet and become so uncontrollably angry that they lose it and say something as ridiculous as he said. Not to mention that his videos tend to be just as much about insulting his opponents as responding to their arguments. Again, I'm certainly not offended by this and I'm not saying it isn't sometimes funny, but I really just have better sources of comedy (Peep Show at the moment Big Grin) and logical arguments than him.
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RE: Skeptics I no longer have any respect for.
(February 16, 2012 at 1:58 pm)Tempus Wrote: Dawkin's view on agnosticism (at the time of The God Delusion), for example, was extremely flawed.

As was his definition of deism.
Atheist Forums Hall of Shame:
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
...      -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
...       -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist
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RE: Skeptics I no longer have any respect for.
(February 16, 2012 at 1:58 pm)Tempus Wrote: After a lot of reading and listening I found the best users on Youtube (regarding skepticism, reason, etc) to be: TheraminTrees, QualiaSoup and Evid3nc3.

Be sure to check out http://www.youtube.com/user/theoreticalbullshit and http://www.youtube.com/user/dasamericanatheist who do a very good job on the philosophical stuff.

I would recommend deistpaladin but he's done bugger all lately. Wink

Best regards,
Leo van Miert
Horsepower is how hard you hit the wall --Torque is how far you take the wall with you
Pastafarian
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