Was Jesus Neanderthal by 1 to 4 per cent?

[dtango]

For those not aware of the achievements of the science of genetics, the reading of the page http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/8660940.stm is a must.

Only sub-Saharan populations are genuine members of the race of the Homo sapiens sapiens. All the rest are contaminated with the genome of the Neanderthals.
It is to be noted, however, that the gene flow went one way: from Neanderthals to Homo sapiens sapiens and not vice-versa. It is obvious that the interbreeding was forced and since the powerful ones, the victors, were the Hss it follows that it was not their women who received the genes of the Neanderthals, it was the Neanderthal women, raped by the victorious Hss male, who contributed their genes to the gene pool of the resulting hybrid offspring.

The first girl who was born to mixed parents was Neanderthal by 50%.
The daughter of that girl was impregnated by either a still pure-blood Hss or a newly produced male hybrid. In any case her Neanderthal genome dropped below that of her mother and it continued to drop until it reached today’s level.

Virgin Mary was a common human with the normal 1%-4% share of Neanderthal genome. That is a non-disputable fact.

The debate question is therefore: what percentage of this 1% to 4% of Neanderthal genome was passed on to her child, given the awkward circumstances of his conception?

[Rev. Rye]

Really, to answer the question: If it's true that God is Jesus' father, it would be more like 0.5-2%. If he was just human, he'd be the full 1-4%. If he never existed, the question would be moot.

But, really, only Sub-Saharans are purely homo sapiens sapiens? I'd love to see how racists would react to this.

[Phil]

More to the point is was Jesus really a woman? If he wasn't, where the hell did he get the Y chromosome from?

[Anomalocaris]

What is "pure" homo sapien? Can the homo sapien content of impure homo sapiens be increased by feeding them through a distillery?

And how do you know interbreeding between homo sapien and Neanderthal occurred in the form of conquering homo sapiens raping neanderthal women?

[Minimalist]

Both HSS and HNS ( if such was really ever a separate "species") inherited the bulk of their DNA from a remote common ancestor - probably Homo Erectus.

[dtango]

What is "pure" homo sapien? Can the homo sapien content of impure homo sapiens be increased by feeding them through a distillery?

And how do you know interbreeding between homo sapien and Neanderthal occurred in the form of conquering homo sapiens raping neanderthal women?

The pure Homo sapiens sapiens left Africa, reached Near East where they interbred with Neanderthals and ceased being pure Homo sapiens sapiens.
Those Homo sapiens sapiens who did not leave Africa remained pure and uncontaminated.

As to how we know the way the interbreeding happened, we have on the one hand science informing us that the gene flow went one way: from Neanderthals to Hss and on the other hand we have every culture and every people on earth insisting that the gods were raping the non-god women.

Both HSS and HNS ( if such was really ever a separate "species") inherited the bulk of their DNA from a remote common ancestor - probably Homo Erectus.

You are missing the point!
Up to approximately 50,000 years ago it was only evolution at play. Both Hss and Neanderthals (Homo sapiens Neanderthalensis) were products of natural evolution while we, moderns, are the product of a forced breeding, a sort of creation we can say. We are hybrids, and as such we wouldn’t be here if it were not for the need Homo sapiens sapiens had to increase quickly their population.

[Abracadabra]

If homo sapiens and neanderthals were close enough genetically to breed, then could it even be said that they were 'separate species' to begin with?

It seem to me that the reductionism and dichotomy that western science attempts to push onto everything via its means of classifying things into distinct categories is a superficial means of measurement to begin with. What is probably far more true is that there never was any cut-and-dried line between two very distinct species of hominids, and what is far more likely to have been the case is that the distinction between what we have classified as being "Homo sapiens" and "Neanderthals" is probably far more fuzzy that western scientists would like to believe.

So I'm not the least bit surprised that there would be overlaps between hominids that we classify as "homo sapiens" and hominids that we classify as "Neanderthal". Nature isn't likely to have classified things in the same neat and orderly way that western scientists like to classify things.

[Minimalist]

Up to approximately 50,000 years ago it was only evolution at play

I fundamentally disagree. We have evidence from Homo Erectus skeletons which indicate that individuals with serious fractures survived for the bones to heal. This is indicative of some social unit which tended to the injured man and enabled him to survive.

Human culture - be it HE, HNS or HSS - interfered with evolution by natural selection. Lions live in structured prides, too. Yet when one is injured in a hunt it lives or dies on its own.

[Oldandeasilyconfused]

Looking at a construction of what Jesus probably actually looked like, perhaps more Cro-magnon than Neanderthal?

[Justtristo]

I fundamentally disagree. We have evidence from Homo Erectus skeletons which indicate that individuals with serious fractures survived for the bones to heal. This is indicative of some social unit which tended to the injured man and enabled him to survive.

Human culture - be it HE, HNS or HSS - interfered with evolution by natural selection. Lions live in structured prides, too. Yet when one is injured in a hunt it lives or dies on its own.

There is also evidence of homo heidelbergensis and neanderthalensis burying their dead with grave goods. I believe that the evidence that would show that both Homo Heidelbergensis and Neanderthalensis had symbolic thought (probably not as developed as ours), along with relatively complex language does not get preserved in the fossil record very much.

For example; it is very probable that Homo Erectus in Asia used tools made out of bamboo. However bamboo does not get preserved in the fossil record unlike stone and bone. It was a mircale that in Germany archeologists found preserved wooden projectile spears dating back 400,000 years.


Anyway, Creationist organisations like Creation Ministries International and Answers in Genesis believe that Homo Neanderthalensis was just a another variety of our species.